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-   -   I don't love my wife and never have... (http://www.2-in-2-1.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=2124)

Roses 6th October 2013 10:16 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sunny (Post 76677)

I tried to leave her 3 times during our engagement alone, once after she took off all her clothes when she was drunk at a party. When I drove her home that night I cried the whole way and she laughed the whole way. The next morning I said it was over, shortly after that she seduced me and again I came back, feeling horrible about myself.

These are hard things to overcome- that's just one of many really damaging things that have gone on over the years. I know the key is forgetting about this and accepting the present but it's so hard, especially after I feel I've given my life over to this person who I never loved, for her benefit, and she threw it away.

So like Raymond says, it's true that the problem is me. She wants me to move on, accept, now that she really is turning into a different person, and she truly is. It's just that messed up thing inside me, the feeling that has never gone away that she's not the one for me. Even now that she is kind, tries to do right by me on all levels, and for the first time listens to me... Just listening and being kind aren't enough to inspire love. They are just the fundamentals of a healthy relationship, which again, I am grateful for.

We had a huge argument the other night, shouting about divorce and legal battles, etc, without much resolution, but we came together again as we always do, holding each other for a long time this morning when the kids were at school, saying nothing. I tied the laces on her running shoes. I don't want to crush her but I know in my heart it's not right. It's so heart wrenching. The cycle goes on...

Hi

I'm kind of getting a feeling that she had been with other men before you decided to marry her?

As you say, this is clearly a vicious cycle which seems to go on since many years. Since you already had an affair and how that made you feel, this may further convince you that your marriage isn't right even more.

I totally get what Chosen/Raymond are saying and I respect their opinions at all times. The difference is that they have love and peace in their marriage. You don't seem to have peace in this marriage (more strife then peace)?

I have a funny feeling that this cycle may continue with intermittent eruptions along the way. You really need to think about not to keep repeating this vicious cycle as it will take a massive toll on you.

I'm sure you are not the only husband who feels this way about your wife. I probably had more hurt and grief from my own marriage so I understand where you are coming from.

If your wife is healthy and well, legally you would have to pay towards your children (maintenance) unless you earn so much and your wife needs to maintain a high class lifestyle etc.

Obviously, you may need to allow your wife and children to remain in your marital home until your children grow up. In my view, it may be worth exploring these so it would help stop having arguments over MONEY. Do something new other than what you have been doing over the past 22/23 years in my honest opinion.

Take good care of yourself.

chosen 6th October 2013 11:03 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Roses as I said before my 25 year first marriage was nothing like my second, and my husbands first marriage wasn't happy, BUT neither of us would have ended the marriage for that reason.
Yes my marriage is happy, but we have been through hard times, expecially in the first 2 years as we struggled with lots of baggage, unsupportive step children, ex wives who were still trying to control, MIL who was trying to break us up etc etc. It was HARD.
No matter what happens in this marriage, I am with him for better or for worse.

I just cant in anyway encourage a man to leave his wife and children and cause no end of hurt and heartache for so many people when there has been no adultery or abuse, and when she is trying so very hard to be a good wife. Whoever said that we can leave a marriage if we don't feel that romantic love? Who said that we can just abandon our wife and children so that we can find that elusive 'soul mate'? Where does this for better and for worse come in?

I suppose that I have seen so many marriages end in my family because of cheating and similar, and have seen first hand the pain and the emotional fall out for the spouses and children, that I can never support anyone leaving their marriage without very strong reasons, especially if there are children.

Sorry to go on but I just feel very strongly about this.

ronnoco 6th October 2013 08:03 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Hi Sunny,

I've been thinking long and hard about your post since I posted on Friday.

It's impossible for anyone to put themselves in your shoes because it's such a complex situation. You have no way of knowing how things will turn out with your wife and more importantly, your children if you did leave and I think this whole dilemma boils down to your children. If you didn't have them, I’m almost certain you would have left your wife a long time ago.

You do however have children who you clearly love very much and if you did leave and couldn't see them and be involved in their lives, I feel that would be terrible and not be a sacrifice worth taking for “the pursuit of happiness” which you so long for. I wonder if I jumped the gun when I said something could be sorted regarding custody of your children. This is vital in my eyes and I can’t be sure of this. Just because my own circumstances so far have turned out really well regarding joint custody, it doesn't necessarily mean yours will, especially based on what you have said about what your wife may do.

I worry about you though. I worry about your health, especially mental health as this problem has clearly been "eating you up" for half your lifetime. This is not good. You are suffering a form of abuse, all be it self-inflicted. Are you running the risk of reducing your life expectancy because of all the stress, worry, and inner conflict? It’s definitely something that needs careful consideration. Your health is important not only for you but for your children.

Sorry I can’t say any more at this moment in time – It’s such a tough, difficult situation but i'll carry on thinking about it.

Wishing you the best.

chosen 6th October 2013 09:22 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
ronocco, don't you think that our health is far more damaged by being double minded about something, and sitting on the fence, than by making a decision to let go of the past, make the best of a situation and stop the dissatisfaction of never being happy or content with what we have? Being double minded is extremely unsettling. Being committed and faithful no matter what because of our promises made and our responsibilities takes away that indecision.

I am sure there are millions of married couples who haven't got that special loving relationship that they would like to have with their spouses, but is that reason enough to just walk out?

I agree about the children. There is no way that I would never ever have walked out on my children no matter how unhappy I was. It simply wouldnt be an option.

chosen 7th October 2013 03:57 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Just wanted to say that forgiveness has nothing do to with love. Its a decision. My first husband did some terrible terrible things that left me and my children devastated and traumatised. We have all had to make that decision to forgive him for what he did no matter what we feel for him, even though we have no contact. One of the children hated him when she was younger, but she too has been able to let it go with Gods help, and forgive. She said it was as if her life till then was in black and white, but after she forgave and let it go,
it was as if everything was in colour.
When we forgive it isn't for the other person, its for ourselves, because unforgiveness and resentment eat us up and cause no end of physical and emotional damage.

I have heard it said that its like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die.
When you have forgiven, you have to keep doing it, and whenever past resentments come up you have to stop yourself from dwelling on them and let them go. You have to make that decision not to bring them up again. Your wife needs to do this as well.

My son did a really good teaching on forgiveness a while back I wish you could hear it.

I am so sorry that the rape ruined your aunts life like that because it didn't need to. I know several people who have been seriously abused as children by parents or other adults, and they all have productive and happy lives now. If only she had allowed God to heal her so that she could have moved on. Its also very sad that she thought it was sinful, and it shows that she must have picked up some very skewed ideas on sex. Of course then there was no where to go for help or support I suppose.

I think its very encouraging that your wife has spoken to you about the rape, and that she is recognising the bad things she did in the past. Isn't that what you have ben waiting for all these years?.

I also want to say that no matter how much you think it would be ok if you left(and you have clearly made all the arrangements in your head) its not. Children hate it when their parents spilt. My parents nearly spilt when I was in my late teens (my father had a long term affair I found out later) and I was terribly upset even at that age, just at the thought of it.
My husbands parents divorced, it still troubles him now sometimes, all these years later.

ronnoco 7th October 2013 03:58 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Chosen - yes I totally agree with you that if he could just make a decision once and for all that he will stick with his wife and not think about how life might be with out her, he most probably would feel so much better about life and possibly learn to accept that this is the life he is going to live, release the burden, those thoughts and fantasies, etc

Trouble is, it's blindingly obvious that he can't do this. You only have to read the post above to know this and if you remember he has even asked to be hypnotised to literally trick himself into not thinking the things he does!

Sunny, my wife left me and there was absolutely nothing I could do about it. I have the set up that you imagine in your head and for me, as it stands, I do truly believe that I do actually have a far better relationship with my children compared to my previous life at this current moment in time.

However, looking at the bigger picture, I do agree with Chosen that it is never a good thing for families to break up and if you were to ask me if I wished this hadn't happened and that we were still together as a family unit - I would say yes, I wished it hadn't happened. The difference between me and you is I truly loved my wife with all my heart and wanted to be with her forever.

chosen 7th October 2013 10:12 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
That's good news sunny. It will take time for you to trust her again, its early days for that. I understand about not wanting to get hurt again. It took me ages to trust my second husband because of what my first husband did, but with time it did happen.

I don't know how old your children are sunny, but don't bet on them leaving that soon!!!
I think its amazing what your son said, and just shows how valuable you both are to him.

chosen 8th October 2013 02:08 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Oh well they will be there for a very long time yet. I have friend with kids well into their late 20's and early 30's still at home!!! Mine had all left by 24, but buying a house is almost impossible for young adults and rents are sky high. Mine all had to home share.
The most challenging time is yet to come for you......the TEENS.:eek:

Raymond 8th October 2013 01:00 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Reading all this through I don't understand Sunny this business about her not letting you go. Staying with her should come out of your freewill and commitment not because she won't let you go. Love is always freewill, not because we have no choice, otherwise it is not really love. There is something wrong in that area somewhere. If you think you are a prisoner no wonder you cannot find that place to love. Marriage should not be like that.

Do you have difficulty in being honest and standing up to people?

Roses 8th October 2013 06:46 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Raymond (Post 76735)
Reading all this through I don't understand Sunny this business about her not letting you go. Staying with her should come out of your freewill and commitment not because she won't let you go. Love is always freewill, not because we have no choice, otherwise it is not really love. There is something wrong in that area somewhere. If you think you are a prisoner no wonder you cannot find that place to love. Marriage should not be like that.

Do you have difficulty in being honest and standing up to people?

Raymond

You said exactly how I was feeling. You put it extremely well.

Raymond 9th October 2013 08:54 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
None of this is her fault. You mentioned your resentment towards her for not letting you go. That is your choice not hers. You shouldn't resent her for that. Not that I advocate desertion but I do advocate some freedom in the relationship.

As for looking for that spark I think that is the same as examining your navel. It will illude you when you look inside yourself. I think it is something which comes imperceptably when you sincerely seek to love her in a practical way. That means not resenting her for not letting you go when it's your choice. (That must kill a lot of your love). Forgiveness from the past needs to happen as well.

Roses 9th October 2013 09:52 AM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Raymond (Post 76749)
Not that I advocate desertion but I do advocate some freedom in the relationship.

As for looking for that spark
I think that is the same as examining your navel. It will illude you when you look inside yourself. I think it is something which comes imperceptably when you sincerely seek to love her in a practical way. That means not resenting her for not letting you go when it's your choice. (That must kill a lot of your love). Forgiveness from the past needs to happen as well.

Your post is full of wisdom.

I often notice many people leaving their "good enough" marriages tend to be those who are profoundly dissatisfied by the lack of spark / attraction.

Some people (used to be men but increasingly more women these days) simply cannot stay happy unless there's that spark in their life. (*You don't need to be Tiger Woods to have this tendency)

Probably, this is something they don't set out to do but it's hard wired and they actually need to find this spark.

Raymond 9th October 2013 01:12 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
I think that getting that spark away from your own marriage only works for a time. Forbidden fruit can be exciting but only for a short time. Two or three years down the line, probably less, you are in exactly the same boat having destroyed your original family. It is well documented that second marriages are far less successful than first marriages.

For me indulging any spark outside of one's own marriage is illegitimate as you are dishonouring your vows and dishonouring the person who has given her life and body to you. Many do not know the preciousness of what they have until they lose it and then it is often too late. Many divorcees advertise themselves as the innocent party therefore there must have been a guilty party? Someone looking for a spark? I think you can get a spark inside of your own marriage if you need it. It only takes communication, effort, imagination and understanding between you. Long term affection is probably more precious at the end of the day.

Roses 9th October 2013 07:25 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Raymond

You are like a shining diamond.

Thank you for sharing.

ronnoco 9th October 2013 10:01 PM

Re: I don't love my wife and never have...
 
Agreed - absolutely fantastic post from Raymond.


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