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Old 15th November 2004, 09:40 PM   #31
smackie9
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Thumbs up Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

On the contrary, There are women, like myself, like porn. My husband looks at it, I look at it. We both enjoy Xrated videos. I've always been comfortable with it.

There is no woman on this planet who's boyfriend/husband indulges solo in porn is happy about it . Usually if are OK with it they will also say, "Oh I don't mind it stops him from having affairs".

Ilah[/QUOTE]
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Old 19th November 2004, 05:38 AM   #32
snakedriver
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Read at own risk:very long! lol

Alright Smackie9! Will you speak to my wife? Lol. My wife and I have been going through this lately. I have deleted any pictures or videos and have abstained from masturbating as much as I can. I thought it wouldn't hurt to try for her, a real honest try. I am a raging sex monster, she is a once a month girl. I will try and give up porn, she will try and realize that all along I wish that she enjoyed porn and sex and all the fantasies out there with me, and try and see herself in a better light. I tell her everyday how beautiful and attractive she is to me, but I think she never really belives it. I always imagined that that was the two of us together, but in the end it just frustrated me that I will never have any of the things I like to watch in person.

Our sex life before marriage was frequent, and a bit more free than it is now. Never crazy, and I made her promise that things wouldn't change after marriage. I realize now that that is a silly thing, you never know what stresses you both will go through. I felt that it was a compromise. She has been my one and only, and after marriage when things slowed down in the bedroom I had all kinds of thoughts like "I gave up sowing my oats for a life with very little sexual pleasure?". Just feeling sorry for myself I guess. I looked for porn that depicted women that looked something like her, and all I really wanted was just a little of that with her.

"Why do you have to look at porn when I'm right here?" she says. Because you do not like anything I really like sexually, you make me feel guilty for wanting more, not because of the porn, the porn is an attemp to fill a void. My desires are for more and that makes me the bad one. Instead of leaving you I realize that all is not sex, I love you for alot more than that, good life, good kids, same goals and dreams, best friends. I don't want to make you feel used for my satisfaction. I will find a way to deal with the lack of stimulation and variety and try and keep it out of your face, out of respect. But you pry into my computer and accuse me of not loving you and wishing I could be with all those other internet women.

"Why do you look at porn when you know that it makes me feel like I am not enough to satisfy you?" She says. Because so far since our wedding day you have made me feel like you only gave me sex to "throw me a piece of candy" and the sex we had before marriage was a way to appeal to me so I would marry you. You blow it off whenever I have tried to talk about it, or tell me that it is my problem because I am the evil horny man, in so many words. That does not feel very good for me. In short, maybe you are not enough to satisfy me sexually. But I make it work anyway, because I love you and we have a lot more together than that. I want more and more adventurous sex, you would be happy if all we had was missionary once a month. I'll deal with it if you attempt even a little bit to put yourself in my shoes. I don't think many women realize how powerful sexual urges can be for some men. Have you ever been really really horny? Be honest. There is a bit of truth to the second brain thing.

Ladies, men are going to wank off. We are going to stare at lovely ladies. That does not mean that we do not wish to be with you, love you, and find you attractive. Because we look at porn that does not mean we will cheat on you. I know my wife and I have many issues there, we may be an extreme case, but from discussion boards to friends, it seems to be a pretty common scenario. She will read this, and we have talked about it, finally like adults. But I refuse to go to another therapist that makes me feel like I am damn near an adulterer, all around bad person for wanting to experiance sex to the fullest. Especially when most women make thier man feel like its only going to get better after marriage. But we never listen to all the married guys that say "you gettin married? Kiss that sex life goodbye" We always think that won't happen, we enjoy sex together too much, its only a cliche. But here I am ten years later tossing around the idea of going to one of those massage parlors. Well, one of us has to suck it up. So I will give an honest try. If she doesn't want more, maybe I can make it right in my own head, find a way to make more out of what we already have. Maybe over time my libido will diminish and we can meet somewhere in the middle. See how it goes after a couple of years. She deserves that. I will try not to think of it as a sacrifice on my part.

Be a fantasy for your man every now and then. Come up with a few things you would like and ask it of him. Just once I would love it if my wife asked me to run my fingers through her hair, or kiss her neck, or anything she wanted instead of her expecting me to intuitively know when or what to do for her, or making me feel like a taker all the time cause I do know what I want. "but you are my fantasy, all I want is this" she says. Hey, thanks for trying a little. Decide where your limits are and every now and again go to the brink of crossing them without doing anything you don't really want to do. Don't indulge him for his sake, it feels crappy as a man to find out your only doing something to get him off your back. But don't freak out if we toss off a little in our spare time. I'm not suggesting anyone else has these particular problems, they are mine and my wifes. Maybe there are some similarities? Take it for what it is. It might suck to know you may not be enough for your man, but it also sucks to know you will have a medeocre sex life until death do we part. Ask a question you may get a really honest answer. This problem has been around since marriage, only now men have unprecidented access to porn of all types. Over 90% of all internet traffic is porn related. If it becomes a problem, an addiction, by all means step in and try your best to help. Sometimes we are just curious too. Most guys are not enjoying porn to hurt thier wives deeply. Knowing that it does makes me want to change. Change works both ways though. Understand that men are different from women. We are visual, horny monsters. And we do not require an emotional connection to get off, but it does enhance things.
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Old 19th November 2004, 12:33 PM   #33
Liz
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Dear Snakedriver

I think a few years ago I would have found what you had to say offensive, but as I read it as a woman I hear some truth and reality in what you say.

I do believe that men and women are different, that men are more turned on by what they see, that many have deep physical needs where sex is concerned. Itís not just a meal female thing though because you can read here of women who want more than their man seems willing to give.

However I do think that married couples can find a place where both are satisfied, but it involves openness and honesty both in day to day communication and in their sexual relationship. It involves seeing the sexual relationship not as something I have a right to, but as something my partner deserves. Itís about giving pleasure not getting pleasure. The challenge is to each partner to become experts at giving pleasure to the other, and to encourage the other perhaps to grown in confidence and openness. That can be daunting for some women and some men.

The sexual relationship between a man and woman in marriage is not just about what happens between the sheets if that is where you do it, but itís about how you behave towards each other all through the day. My husband has been away on business for a couple of days he rang me this morning from work and I could hear in what he said how passionately he loved me and how much I mattered to him, how much he valued me as his wife. I felt special and important to him. Heíd left some notes scattered around the house including in our bed for me to find while he was away Ė such concern for me and eye for detail makes me feel special too. That sort of caring and valuing gives me confidence to respond or even initiate physical contact with him, whether it be cuddles or a simple kiss on the back of his neck or something more. Itís taken us some years to open up to each other about how we feel about love making, what hang ups we have about it and to work through those. I have chosen to face my hang ups because I want to be close to him. He has chosen to temper his imagination a little and to enjoy what is offered, so that I donít feel pressurised. Heís been patient over the years and I have become more confident and adventurous.

My concerns about pornography is that it plants images and ideas in a personís mind which make ordinary love making seem tame. They feed a hunger for more or weirder things. Pornography hurts fragile emotional women often Ė it damages their self esteem and causes them to shrink away into themselves. It is for some akin to adultery, because there is no longer only the two of you in the relationship, even if you donít see these other women as real.

I salute your willingness to set aside your needs for the sake of your relationship. I believe there is great power for growth in a relationship based on that sort of giving, but I also sense in what you are saying that a lot of your self worth is based on how good a lover you are, just as your wife has strong needs to be cherished and dealt with gently and emotionally. Your identity is not in how much sex you can get or how wild a sex life you have. You are more than just a sexual being. Are you sure that your involvement with pornography has not fuelled your desire for more and different? Is it really helping you to enable your wife to grow in confidence and become more adventurous? What could you do to help your wife to develop in this way? Does she need to know she is the only one, that she is special and more important than your own needs? Are there other areas of your relationship that need attention to ensure that you are both fully open and happy with your life together?

Liz

PS I wrote this before reading your other posting and so I realise now some of the reasons why you are both struggling in this area of your lives. Having seen the deep scarring that rape can leave I know that this whole area will be very difficult for you both. I also hear your sense of betrayal too about hearing the former lovers that were denied. I can understand your wife denying any past sexual history when it was so painful for her and she was probably afraid to face it or that you mioght reject her if you knew. Although this happened before your marriage you may find the article on this subject here helpful.

Last edited by Liz; 19th November 2004 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 20th November 2004, 03:53 PM   #34
Charlie0015
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Liz...what you said about porn planting images is very true. And it's not just that porno babes are usually better looking than your average wife, it's also that they will do anything sexually. And this in itself can put pressure on a marriage.

Things tend to escalate when it comes to the types of turn on's a husband who watches alot of porn wants from his wife. It may start innocently enough with a simple request to wear something sexy. But it may go beyond that as the guy wants to reproduce what he's seeing in the videos. He askes her to shave, maybe get breast implants. He starts asking for anal sex and to give her "facials" He may ask to bring a third party in to the bedroom or for her to allow him to tie her up. This would all be OK if the wife agrees but for hard core pron users where does it stop?

Porn users get desensitized to what they are watching very quickly and need harder and harder action to get turned on. The video producers understand this and work hard to create harder and harder sex scenes in their films.

MOST men just watch once in awhile and that's it, but for the daily user the marriage can start to fall apart. Reading previous posts here you can see what the consequences are.
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Old 24th November 2004, 02:39 AM   #35
smackie9
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Well this woman (me) doesn't mind if her husband enjoys a little porn. And I hope he shares it with me when he does. He doesn't have to keep it a secret.
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Old 24th November 2004, 04:30 AM   #36
Juliann
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Just pray it never gets to the point where he prefers the porn to having sex with you. My husband and I had a great sex life until he discovered computer porn. Our marriage has been basically sexless for almost 3 years. I have two kids and can't afford to leave him. He spends half the night looking at the computer porn and masturbating.
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Old 25th November 2004, 03:48 AM   #37
snakedriver
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Liz,


Thanks for a response to that that was well thought out and meaninful. I feared in posting that that I would just be attacked. You and your husbands relationship sounds alot like mine and my wifes, as far as the romantic part goes. I have left a trail of stuffed animals leading to love notes, arranged many romantic nights alone, that kind of thing. I really believe that foreplay starts when you wake up in the morning, not 20 mins before sex. And your right, giving can be more satisfying. The experiance for me is a lot more intense if I know she is feeling good.

Porn does different things for different poeple, but it does diminish how exciting everyday marital sex can be if your partner is not a porn star. That is why I have abstained from viewing it, I felt the beginnings of addiction when I decided to give it up. I started immediately justifing why it was ok. That was enough for me. I understand her point, I can see why some women find it offensive and disgusting, make her think she is not enough, all of that. The only problem is, now I get to go back to missionary once a month. I meant what I said during our vows, and I am trying to let go of any selfish tendencies. I do want to help her, I am going to try and figure out how. I know I am having trouble with some immature feelings, logically I know some things shouldn't bother me. A good honest try at quitting porn and being there for her is all I can give right now, it will take time. I am dealing too. We've both sacrificed a lot, just never thought I would have to in the bedroom. It sucks, change what you can, accept what you can't. All and all I think if all these posts are read, and you take the median out of them, you get a pretty good picture of what its all about and what it really means in marriage.

Liz, as far as my other post, the part that makes me feel betrayed the most is I thought I had found someone who abstained before she found the right love as I had. I had been close a few times, but it never felt right. I never had religious views on it or anything, I just listened to myself. I don't think of myself as a better person than her or anything, I understand that things are much different for a beautiful young woman than for your average guy. A lot more pressure. Not all of her experiances were as horrible as rape. She had many partners that treated her halfway decent. Thats almost harder to hear. The crux is she just let me believe that. Knowing it just makes me want to be there for her, and run screaming at the same time. I know she feared that I would reject her. She has come to me several times to discuss things, I have let her know that its ok, I'm here. It still hits me like a brick in the face sometimes though. It really sucks that I have to deal with baggage brought about by other guys. There is more to it than that, but I think I need my own post for it. Sorry such a long post, it just spills out.

Last edited by snakedriver; 25th November 2004 at 04:03 AM. Reason: Didn't address previous questions
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Old 25th November 2004, 04:11 AM   #38
snakedriver
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Thanks for the link Liz, I have read it and it pretty much describes my range of emotions lately, much to my chagrin. I know ours is not the same situation as adultery but its interesting to me that knowing the truth about my wifes past feels a bit like being cheated on. I will look for other resources dealing with that. It may help!
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Old 26th November 2004, 03:06 AM   #39
Mithreeboy
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

My wife and I for years have both watched porn and mastrubated together while watching, it's different things sexually that keeps things from getting routene. She also uses toys on herslf or me using the toys on her. Is it so bad we need the extra thrill instead of going out for it????? As many different things you can get in your sex lives will enhance it and keep it fun! After 12 years we had sex at least 5 times a week sometimes twice or 3 times a day!!!! My wife has an extreme gift though orgaism after orgasism 1 a minute, know it sounds crazy but it's true. She has made me want it more, so sometimes I need to settle it on tapes, be open, it's better there than outside your marriage, and it doesn't mean in any way or form he doesn't enjoy you the MOST!
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Old 30th November 2004, 03:54 AM   #40
Sad Guy
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Unhappy Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Here's my situation......my wife for the past 5 years has been an EXCELLENT mother to our two children ages 5 and 3. The problem I have is that she recently mentioned that she used a "toy" to have what she would classify as a "real good O". You know, after months of partner sex and hearing "oh, I think I had a little one, maybe a second or two", that tends to wear kinda thin on me especially since we used to have GREAT experiences not many years ago. She's been very stressed out caring for the kids (I do my fair share of child care too) and I've noticed a sense of distance this past year. By that I mean emotionally and physically. I don't know if it's the actual act that bothers me more or the underlying reasons that may accompany that (ie drifting apart mentally, lack of interest in the marriage etc.etc). This past year it's almost been like we've been roommates taking care of two little ones.

My issues

1. I feel rejected, betrayed by her little sexual escapade. I feel as though I don't
satisfy her although I know I've tried. Sure people say it's not a substitute but this certainly gives me vibes of "substitution".
2. She gives me lame excuses like I was asleep or I turned her away (which are totally untrue). She later explained that "she just had to say something". What's that all about?
3. She tells me that "oh, it's not you, it's me". How is it her if she's telling me the crap I mentioned in #2 above?
4. I just can't come to terms with the fact that she turned to a little piece of plastic to get her off when partner sex is always available. She tells me how bad, guilty she felt after the first time but I guess she didn't feel bad enough or it just felt too good for her to stop there. I think a little communication could have made our sex life together much better. I'm finding it hard to look at her in the same way.

This has really opened up issues that mean more to me than masturbation like emotional connection, communication, and conveying one's needs to the other.

Please don't flame me. I am an honest, caring husband and father who happens to be sensitive to this issue. I've got ethics, morals and respect everyone. Can someone help me cope? Does anyone feel the same way? If so, how do you cope? I'm depressed. I don't know how these horrible visions seem to just pop into my head in the middle of the day followed by this very very empty feeling in the pit of my stomach.
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Old 30th November 2004, 04:39 AM   #41
smackie9
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Wink Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Most men feel intimidated by the power tool in the bedroom. Don't worry, it doesn't replace you.We still rather have the real thing. My suggestion is to find toys that you both can use and enjoy together. Go to www.mypleasure.com to find some cool stuff. There's the "Beginner's Vibe Pleasure Kit" that would be perfect for you and your wife. You can even use these toys in the shower! OOOOh what fun! P.S. they even have toys for men too!
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Old 30th November 2004, 08:47 PM   #42
Kate
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Dear Sad Guy

I think you've brought up a really good point. Sex is best when it's between two people who care deeply about each other, who are expressing their love for one another in what they do. When the other person turns to toys or porn or someone else without consulting their spouse then it hurts. The other person is saying "my pleasure is more important than my relationship with you". I'm afraid that's just straight selfish.



However I do think that many of us find it hard to talk about our sexual relationship and so it sometimes seems easier to give into our own desires than to explore them with our partner. Again that is not surprising because our sexuality is so important to who we are, so we fell very vulnerable talking about it.



I hope that you two can find ways to talk about your physical relationship, what gives you pleasure, what gives the other pleasure, what turns you off, what you feel about each other when your sexual relationship is going well.

Kate
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Old 30th November 2004, 09:41 PM   #43
sad guy
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Dear Kate and Smackie9

Thanks for your replies. It's nice to have some female feedback plus it's nice to feel the friendship and heartfelt messages. Thanks.
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Old 2nd December 2004, 03:39 PM   #44
sad guy
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Question Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

One last comment. The little incident from message 40 above occured in our bedroom with the little ones asleep in the bed! I was probably asleep on my mattress right next to the king size!! It just kind of caught me and shocked me that she would do this in that environment. Makes me sad to think that there was some sort of desperation there to wait till everyone was in la-la land. All by your lonesome is one thing, but this.........?

Again, please don't torch me or my wife but am I over-reacting? About the desparation part?

sad sad guy
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Old 5th December 2004, 07:46 PM   #45
Lovey
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Re: masturbation, porn and marriage

Some of you have asked how a woman (wife) has dealt with their hubby masturbating to porn.

Install a tracker on the computer, to ensure he's not watching ANY porn. I realised that I'm too jealous- even though I work in porn- something that I'm quitting.
He has told me he is jealous if I watched porn without him, as he doesn't want me looking at other men.
We have sex once a day now, cut back from twice, until I feel more comfortable with my trust of him. If I feel upset and mistrustful, we talk, hold eachother and it helps.
Going to therapy for some may help. Since I have training in therapy, we're doing it ourselves.
We did the test to see if he was addicted. He was just fine with doing it, and he answered yes to only a few questions. Three - which was not much, and was all about how the porn affected his marriage. This helped us to realise just how much of an issue it was aside from my not liking it!
He lets me talk about it whenever I like, and is open to questions.
That's all we're doing to make things better. I think that since he isn't watching it anymore, I now can learn to trust that there will be no more hiding, no more lies and no more other women to look at. Frankly, I don't think he needs it. He can look at me, look at my nude pictures and whack off to them.
Men and women do not need porn to get off. We have loads of sex toys, lingerie, our sexy naked bodies and that's all I want.
I am glad that he is unselfish enough to get rid of the porn, and take me instead.
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