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Old 27th April 2010, 12:36 PM   #1
Lofty591
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Help on my seperation...

Hi All,

I hope someone might help me get an insight into what to do next.
I'll give you some background.
My wife and I met 7 years ago in Cambridge. I am an Engineer, and at the time Em was a Student Doctor. We fell madly in love, and we had an awesome relationship. Three years later we married, and we were really happy together. We had big plans, and looked forward to what life would throw at us.
Shortly after this, it appears now I started to suffer with clinical depression. I have fought loads of things in my life, bullies, child obesity (I am now 6'4" 13st and a Triathlete!!) testicular cancer, but you cant fight something you cant see. Depression crept up on me and I had no idea it was there. Eventually I was diagnosed, but being in that state, you just shrug it off as nonsense. I lost all my drive, my ambition, my ability to feel and love, and ultimately, over time, Em lost her love for me.
After our separation, i sank deeper, and it was eventually friends and family who finally got me to acknowledge perhaps the very serious nature of my condition, and its full extent. Since then I have been on an amazing counseling service, which has restored me over time to greater than my former self. Its like having the lights turned back on, and my heart plugged back in. I am truly (Chemically) a different person, to the extent that I even talk of the past as a different me.
Unfortunately, It was the different me that led my poor wife to not be able to hold on any longer. Technically, we had it all. Nice house, both lovely people, good incomes, and the world ahead of us, but it all started to disappear. The once sound footing I gave her to push off from started to crumble away, and take her down too.

She did what she had to do, and I completely understand that. I cant bear the thought of the pain I must have caused her through that period, and the things i said and did (or didn't do) that caused her to have to make the decision to walk away. I wake up every morning with a broken heart. For the record, we have been separated 9 months.

Initially I didn't deal with the break very well, still being in depression, I blamed her for changing(!!) that her career was taking over and that she had no time for me. It is true that her career was progressing to take up much of her time, as Junior Doctors lives go, but the fact that I was not the person I was meant to be, probably meant I wasn't worth spending time with either.

However, now we are back on good terms. We have started to speak and meet a few times, and Em, bless her has noticed the massive change back in my personality - she recognises that after the long term help I sought to battle my depression, that her "Lauly" (nickname for Paul!) is back. We flirt, joke, laugh and cry together.
To me, there is something clearly still there. She can see the old me back again, and comments so much on how my will power is back, that im so much happier (despite being separated from her, and living a nightmare every day). She constantly says sorry for leaving, and that pain it must have caused me.
I know we still love each other, and we have more fun in the last few weeks than we ever had through my depression stage.

Em still cant go back, or forward with me, or however you want to see it. Divorce is still on the cards. I totally understand that she is in self preservation mode, but being practically a new person (and thats how it feels coming out of depression) it feels like I have woken up into this nightmare, after someone else has pushed my wife away, and potentially taken the love of my life away for good.

I need to know how to progress with this. I am making no inroads to moving on, mainly because I don't want to, and that I feel I shouldn't yet. We have an amazing marriage in there somewhere, one that would now be effortless and fulfilling, but for one thing, her fear of trying again.

Very occasionally, when we get emotional about things, and cry over our lost marriage, she says that "shes not making any rash decisions" or "she's in no rush to file for divorce" but usually the stance is that we cant go back. I love spending time with her again, but I know that I am pushing my own self destruct button unless something comes of it soon.
I know that she has thrown herself into her career in the last few months even more, and I now fear that she thinks being with me may hold her back in her new quest.

Would counseling work here? Is it too late for that? Are we going to be the most compatible couple ever to divorce?
All advice gratefully received. I have no plans left...
P
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Old 27th April 2010, 12:54 PM   #2
Raymond
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Re: Help on my seperation...

It's never too late for counseling Lofty. It never hurts to sit down with someone together and to go through the fears and hopes.

Obviously your wife's faith has taken a knock and she is fearful about giving it another go. I see two problems here. One she needs time to re relate again and to decide whether she wants to make a go of it. She will be thinking about this a lot but it can't be rushed. After a reasonable time you will obviously want to know what she thinks. The other problem is that in your anxiousness you could be in danger of not giving her enough time.

The thing is you are still married and she is not in a rush to get divorced so can't you enjoy the benefits of marriage now or at least enjoy the courting? Until a divorce happens she is still your wife and I don't think it will be long before you are acting like a married couple again. If there is a problem it will be in her mind, but things can change as you enjoy each other in the now. People do mature and she might well be growing in this and feel able to make a commitment to the marriage she already has.

Raymond
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Old 27th April 2010, 01:08 PM   #3
Lofty591
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Raymond,

Many thanks for your response. You couldnt have hit the nail more on the head.

I think that is pretty much how I am feeling. We do enjoy spending time together, and she said just the other night that she still enjoys my company. I am more than happy doing what we are at the moment, but I am very aware that I may start falling back into feeling that I have a relationship with her, when in fact she is just thinking we are good friends.

If you were to look in on us as an outsider when we are together, you would think we were a very happily married, in love, young couple. However, when (and I try to prevent this as much as possible, but sometimes it starts to happen without me realising) we start to talk about the future, its as if she's moved on already. I just dont appear in it.

I feel she is fighting it, because even thought i love her to bits, she's a stubborn lass!

I think this is why if I could get her to agree to a relate session, without her feeling like i am trying to "persuade" her to be back with me, we mgiht be able to uncover something.

I know she hurt, and she is self preserving, but I feel there is so little reason to divorce - or perhaps I am just underestimating the pain that she went through. By the end, she had made herslef quite ill - apparently, in her words "How can you tell someone you care so much about that you cant be with them any more" - The stress and the panic nearly did for her.

I think this needs more time, like you say...

Thanks
P
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Old 27th April 2010, 01:14 PM   #4
Helen_uk
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Counselling might work, but I think what's needed here is to slow things right down. Build on what you have left , friendship and mutual feelings and let the trust that's needed build itself back up for your wife.

Depression is such a selfish condition ( have been a long term sufferer myself ) and whilst in the midst of it it becomes all consuming, very scary for the other person to witness as you try to self destruct so it would take lots of time for your wife to overcome the fears it might happen again.

Try not exert pressure , maybe go back to dating and just enjoying being together and let your wife see the changes are permanent and meantime take very good care of yourself, depression is one of those things that aren't always apparent to the sufferer and can creep back up when you think it's beat . Most of all listen to the concerns she has and acknowledge them.

I really do hope it works out for you both.

Helen
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Old 27th April 2010, 02:03 PM   #5
Algenon49
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Hi Lofty,

Being in a similar situation i feel for you! i am only 3 months into my separation and yes every day is torture, i have come to the conclusion and i'm sure many people here will agree with it that what Helen is saying is right, slow down don't be pushy ( hard i know ) and in time hopefully things may turn around for you, that is what i'm doing, it's a long hard road but love will find a way.

Be strong, i'm thinking of you.

A.
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Old 27th April 2010, 02:31 PM   #6
Lofty591
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Thanks Guys for your advice. It helps to know others are in a simalar situation.
Helen - Equally nice to hear from someone who knows what its like to be in depression. It scared me so much that such a major personality change could occur without me realising... until it had gone.
Looking back, the change in me was simply horrific. I feel so much for Em for having to cope with it.

Thanks
P
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Old 27th April 2010, 02:58 PM   #7
Helen_uk
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Depression is such a huge factor to deal with, whether it's your own or a loved one's that it really is quite frightening .

Hindsight is a wonderful thing though, it's the present that matters now. At least you now know what the problem was and will hopefully recognize the warning signs if it recurs .. and hopefully that will be reassuring to Em.

I think lots of people on here have suffered from with or are still dealing with the depression demon and it's quite sad how many relationships break down as a result.

You've done all the right things though and are continuing to try to put things right, all power to you . It sounds like you and Em have a very strong bond and I'm really hopeful that you can save your marriage . Previous to your bout of depression it sounds to have been a strong and loving relationship , that's a rare thing these days so I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you both.

Helen
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Old 27th April 2010, 03:51 PM   #8
Wiggle
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Lofty,
I am where your wife was.

My long term boyfriend (living together 8.5 years) has been depressed for about the past 5 years. I didn't realise for a good while. I begged him to go to the doctors about a year ago. He went, but wouldn't take the medication. He's been seeing a counsellor instead for the past year - without telling me. I think the counselling helped him understand why he is the way he is, but I don't think it's helped his state of mind. He's apparently been trying to 'talk' about the relationship for the past 3 years or so, but never did so directly, and I've been living in misery the past 4 -5 years; constant criticism, permanent grumpiness and negativity, loss of joy-de-vivre, extreme perfectionism, low self-esteem on his side etc - all the classic stuff, which of course impacted hugely on our relationship. No love life, no hugs or compliments, no emotional support, very little fun. My confidence hit rock bottom. There were days when I'd sit in the car on the drive not wanting to go into the house because I knew I'd get hit with a wall of criticism and negativity.
We had a major chat this Jan that resulted in me being quite ill and I moved out 3 months ago into a rented room. I've gradually been getting my confidence and get-and-go back. We've been to one session of Relate, and meet up for a chat an hour once a week. I still want to work on things now I've got a much better idea of what was wrong (we've finally been talking), but he says he doesn't know what love is, doesn't know what he wants, not sure of anything. All this is hugely hurtful and I feel like cutting contact down to e-mails and moving on just to protect myself.

Ok, so all that has probably made you fell even more guilty! What I'm trying to say is I can speak - for me at least- from a very similar position. I would give ANYTHING - move, change jobs, emigrate - to get my old OH back, but that's never going to happen. You can't go back to what was. What you can try to do is move forward, together if possible. She is probably petrified of getting hurt again. I wouldn't want to go through the last 5 years again. It's been hell.

How much does she know about depression? Since I moved out I have been doing huge amounts of research on the web and reading books on relationships and depression which has been very helpful, although it doesn't stop the comments hurting. If she understood it a bit more she might feel less scared?

I agree with the time thing. A few weeks or months is not going to heal years of misery. She needs to see that this isn't a temporary 'cure'. Talking to her about everything that's been going on in your head as well as in the relationship is really important, and be completely honest.

I do think counselling - Relate, or as has been recommended to me a counsellor who's a specialist in dealing with couples and depression, would be worth a go. If nothing else, it demonstrates your level of commitment.

All I can talk about is from my personal viewpoint. What would work for me if my ex got his depression under control and wanted to make a go of it?
  • I'd like an emergency plan; something we both agreed on / worked so that if the symptoms started to show again, which regretably it can, we had an action plan of some sort to work with.
  • A cast-iron promise from him that he'd do whatever was necessary - pills, counselling, hypnotherapy, whatever, to try and beat the depression should it raise it's ugly head again.
  • A recognition from him that it might happen again.
  • I'd need him to fully recognise (and this is the bit my ex admits he can't do right now) the impact of his depressive behaviour on me. It sounds like you're not fully aware of the impact it may have had on her.
  • I'd want full-on courting & wooing, but with no heavy pressure or expectations - as though we were dating again.
  • It'd take a lot of time to build up any level of trust again; you can't leap straight back in after that level of damage has been done. Currently all I can associate him with are negatives. It would need time to replace those negative associations with something more positive.
I'm angry at what's happened and the things he's said, but because of his state of mind I've not yet felt able to express that anger. She might have some angst to express too....

Although I recognise that depression can cause an individual to behave uncontrollably out of character through no fault of their own, I can't alter the fact that the person who was suppopsed to love and support me, has made me feel like sh*t. There's an element of betrayal there. He'd have a lot of making up to do.

I think you've made great strides in putting yourself back together again - I wish my ex was where you are now. But don't try to run before you can walk. Good luck!

Ps.any advice from your side of the fence would be greatly appreciated!

Last edited by Wiggle; 28th April 2010 at 08:40 AM.
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Old 27th April 2010, 05:54 PM   #9
Raymond
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Re: Help on my seperation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lofty591 View Post
Raymond,
If you were to look in on us as an outsider when we are together, you would think we were a very happily married, in love, young couple. However, when (and I try to prevent this as much as possible, but sometimes it starts to happen without me realising) we start to talk about the future, its as if she's moved on already. I just dont appear in it.
P
This clearly shows she is not ready to fully re-commit again Lofty, but it's early days. You have a lot of positives going. Give her time to work it out and enjoy the present.

The future has to come out of the present.

Raymond
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