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Old 28th December 2010, 01:35 PM   #1
Jimsdarliing
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Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

My husband and I have been together for almost three years now. He has a lot of old friends but there is one that I believe he is too friendly with. She's married but not happily so he seems to think that he has to make her feel better. He had her picture on the night stand on his side of the bed until I said something about it so he mooved it three feet away onto the dresser. He flatters her and calls her names like "foxy" and I think he's a little too physical with her. He thinks I'm just a jealous person. I'm 57 and have never been thought of as so before. We went to the movies and he sat between us, holding my hand and stroking it affectionately on his right and doing the exact same to her on his left. We got in the hot tub and he's massaging her feet. The last straw--we were in the car on the way to a banquet and when he reaches behind me in the front seat to lay his hand on her leg in the back seat. There were many other times I thought I was seeing something but was unsure. I was looking for a gift for her when he told me, "Don't you worry about _____. I'll take care of her." Am I being unreasonable for never wanting to be around her again?
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Old 28th December 2010, 03:47 PM   #2
Forever
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Good grief woman, he's got something going for her and in plain sight. A pic of her on the nightstand?!!! Does he think you are stupid or what? Maybe you should get a pic of her husband and put it on your side of the bed? Nah, forget that, your husband would'nt even care if you did.

What would you advise someone else to do if they confided these things to you?

He's got alot of audacity calling you jealous, being he is the one who is causing all those feelings. You have good reason to feel that way, and you KNOW it. My advice is to have a nice chat with her as well as to alert her husband. If your concern is that you might come off looking paranoid or jealous, then you are going to be in for a whole lot more pain.

Oh, and sorry to say, but just because YOU dont want to ever be around her again, does not mean that HE is going to go along with that. He is having way too much fun. What did he give her as a gift by the way? Is he a Christian?

Last edited by Forever; 28th December 2010 at 05:06 PM.
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Old 28th December 2010, 04:16 PM   #3
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

One other thing, I wonder how many others have noticed his attention to this "friend". If he can barely contain himself in front of you as his wife, Ill bet he is even more sloppy in front of others. His friends are probably wondering why you put up with it. Why ARE you putting up with this?

Sorry, maybe others can share better thoughts and advice than I can. I see so many gentle, lovely women here get stomped on. Why? Because they are afraid to draw the lines about what they will tolerate from their husband. They are afraid of everything, afraid to do anything, meanwhile, they are made to be at fault. They find all kinds of reasons to excuse some of the most dispicable behavior because they live in fear that if they rock the boat, then somehow they did something to destroy the marriage. Meanwhile, their lives become a bigger nightmare. You dont have a whole lot to lose if you married a man who does these things, then turns the tables on you.

Last edited by Forever; 28th December 2010 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 28th December 2010, 05:31 PM   #4
chosen
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Are you serious? I almost couldn't believe this when I read it. His behaviour is so wrong and inappriopriate that it takes my breath away. He has a picture of her next to his bed!?!. He holds her hand and strokes it!?!?. He puts his hand on her knee.!?!? He massages her feet in the hot tub?!?!He is acting as if he has 2 wives, I am surprised that he hasnt got her in the bed, with him in the middle between you both. What is she doing going to the cinema with you and your husband?. Where is her husband?
His behaviour is appalling, dangerous and I am surprised that you have put up with it this long.
Is he a Christian? Is she a Christian? if you all are, I suggest that you go and speak with your pastor or one of the elders and his wife and speak to them. If it were my pastor he would have him in quick smartish, and in no uncertain terms be seriously warning him.This is NOT the way that a married man should be acting with another woman. I wonder how he would feel if you sat between him and another man in the cinema, while holding both hands and stroking them. I am also amazed that this women thinks it is OK to act like with with your husband, even under your nose.What is she playing at?
I am totally 100% in a agreement with forever.If he were my husband this would have been dealt with long ago. I am great believer in strict boundaries in a marriage, I have seen far too much appalling behaviour, and this case is one of them. As forever said, what does he do with you not there? I dread to think.

My advise is for you to both to stop all contact with this woman, or at least limit it to when her husband is there as well. However this doesnt deal with the total lack of boundaries that he has with other women, and for that he needs some accountability with men from the church.There is no way that he should be buying her presents either without you.

I never touch any men except for my husband, son, or brother. My husband doesnt touch any women, except for his step daughters (the occasionsl hug), or me.
Honestly I am gobsmacked at his behaviour,and he blames you for being jealous????What a cheek.

Last edited by chosen; 29th December 2010 at 11:56 AM.
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Old 29th December 2010, 02:29 PM   #5
Raymond
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

This is so obviously wrong it is incredible. Goodness knows what is going on in his head. That he does it in front of you JD is amazing.

Is he feeding this from the internet or what? There are some weird ideas going on out there these days. You musn't co-operate with it in any way. It must stop now. You must get the point over.

My thought is to smash that picture of her he has in the bedroom to get the point across. I am not sure about that but that is just my feeling.

Jealousy is not a bad feeling in these situations as it is wanting what is rightfully yours and not putting up with someone who is usurping some of your position. Also there is a right anger which will give you the power to do the right thing. Envy is wanting what belongs to someone else. Even God is jealous over us. He says he will use us to provoke Israel to jealousy. Would he provoke someone to evil? No. He provokes them to want what is rightfully theirs and to do something about it..

Same in your marriage. You cannot sit back and let this happen. If it carries on you could end up a threesome which is a perversion of what God has revealed under the new covenant.
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Old 30th December 2010, 10:10 AM   #6
Jimsdarliing
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Thank you all so much for the advice. He is a Christian and, although it may not sound like it, he's a really good man and loves me a lot. He sees it all as harmless flirtation and doesn't understand how hurtful it is to me but I'm going to make him see.
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Old 30th December 2010, 10:30 AM   #7
chosen
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Jimsdarling, there is no such thing as 'harmless' flirtation, and to be honest this is way beyond that anyway.He is treating her as if she is his wife or girlfriend. I do wonder what is going on in her head as well to think that this is normal behaviour.I bet they dont do it when her husband is around.

Last edited by chosen; 30th December 2010 at 10:48 AM.
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Old 30th December 2010, 02:03 PM   #8
Raymond
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

I hope you get him to see the point JD. Touching another woman's knee etc. is sexual and has no place outside of marriage. Us men have to be careful in these things.

A married man in our church touched my wife's knee after giving her a lift a few years ago. She was very unhappy about it and told me immediately. It was a big thing to her whatever it was in his mind. Marriage is meant to be sacrosanct in those things.
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Old 30th December 2010, 02:55 PM   #9
chosen
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
I hope you get him to see the point JD. Touching another woman's knee etc. is sexual and has no place outside of marriage. Us men have to be careful in these things.

A married man in our church touched my wife's knee after giving her a lift a few years ago. She was very unhappy about it and told me immediately. It was a big thing to her whatever it was in his mind. Marriage is meant to be sacrosanct in those things.
Raymond I agree totally. if a man touched my knee or tried to hold my hand and stroke it, I would tell him in no uncertain terms to stop immediatly. I wonder if the OW's husband is aware of these things that go on? It maybe why her marriage isnt very good because she is holding a candle for your husband. A man who flirts doesnt have a photo of the lady by his bed.
JD, you say that he loves you but if he did why would he act so badly and hurt you?Is it possible that he loves both of you and wants both of you? Are other people in the church aware of what he does? if so have any of them said anything?
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Old 30th December 2010, 09:45 PM   #10
Raymond
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

I think he is deceiving himself. He might think he is being loving but it is obvious that something else has crept in that shouldn't be there.
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Old 31st December 2010, 03:42 AM   #11
Jimsdarliing
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

I thank God for and love you guys for taking the time to reassure me. I thought I was losing my mind. I now feel I have to confront him about it all after the new year and family holiday obligations are fulfilled. Please pray for it all to come out well.
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Old 31st December 2010, 10:38 AM   #12
chosen
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

JD
No you arent loosing your mind, in fact you have put up with thing that few would have. It may be an idea for you to write down some boundaries for his behaviour with her (and any other women)so that you have something to start with. A good book on this subject is called "Hedges" by Jerry B Jenkins. It is all about putting hedges round our marriage to protect it. I think you can get it on amazon.

He may not want to listen, as he is probably enjoying what he does, but if he refuses, it may be worth going to counselling together, or going to see the pastor together. He really needs to hear it from other people as well as you.

The first thing that needs to happen I would say, is for him to stop seeing this other lady, unless her husband is there. No one on one time with her or any other women, and stop the touching completely, and the photo needs to go. She doesnt need to go to the cinema, or anywhere else, with the two of you. If she wants to go, then her husband can come as well.
Touching, like on the knee, and holding hands etc, is for you and you alone. These things are very intimate.
I Will pray for you, (and I am sure others here will as well) that he sees sense.
God Bless

Last edited by chosen; 31st December 2010 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 31st December 2010, 01:42 PM   #13
Raymond
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

I can't add to that.

Will be praying for you JD that the message gets through to him from you or others and of course the HS.
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Old 31st December 2010, 02:18 PM   #14
chosen
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

Jd another thought occured to me. Do you know her husband quite well? Is he aware of what is happening?. Does it happen when he is there?
If your husband wont listen to you, it may be an idea to fill him in as well. I honestly cant see any husbands who would be happy at what his wife and another man are doing, such as this.
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Old 1st January 2011, 02:23 PM   #15
marriedforlife
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Re: Q: At what point is touching no longer appropriate for just friends?

I am the friend. My husband and I both have been friends with her husband for many years...over 20-25 years. I love my husband and we have been through a lot together and he is a private individual. When the original poster met our friend, he had been through a lot as well. She became a very good friend. I am a Christian and know my husband doesn't want me talking about him to anyone, but her husband is his best friend and we had come to be like brother/sister. I, too have posted on a Christian forum and was advised to talk with someone concerning other things having nothing to do with this situation...just have someone to talk to. When I thought she was a true friend, I felt comfortable talking with them about things concerning my husband. With her husband because he has been like one of the family; with her because we seemed to be kindred spirits. My husband calls him his "brother." They both served in the military and have common experiences. We have had common experiences in hobbies, trips, and other things friends of such long standing have. He has pictures of many people from these experiences, mine included. One thing I have learned from this experience is, not to confide in anyone. Her husband is a dear man who is affectionate with several women that he has known much longer than his wife. His "touching" is not sexual; it is his nature. She has made him happy and I am happy for them. I do not want anything more than a friendship relation with him. The "touching" she is referring to, is nothing like it was presented. I want him to be happy- I want THEM to be happy. I want to be happy with my husband...not do anything to destroy anyone's marriage. I am trying desperately to make my own husband happy. He tends to not want to go and do much and when I am there without him is when she "sees" things that are not there. I didn't go to a movie with them. There was a play we went to in which the audience lights were dimmed, but not off.

I know that to anything there are three sides to a story...mine, yours, and the real one. I have prayed about this situation and I want to deal with it between myself and my God. JD should also do the same. God knows the real story. I do not wish to and will not come between her and her husband. A decades-long friendship cannot end because of something not there, but I can hold my distance.
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