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Old 1st April 2013, 07:25 PM   #1
freddie
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How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

Hello, I have been here before. I have a long story so I will cut it as short as possible. I may have to come back here to give more information. For those who do not want to read it all, I am looking for advice as to how to interpret my wife's view of our marriage, which made her unhappy to the point of setting about looking for another man.

My wife and I have been married 10 years. We have two wonderful daughters aged 9 and 4. We have had a bit of a stormy relationship but we stuck together. The recession hit us hard and caused damage to the relationship. My wife has really always acted recklessly but I learned to live with that and, recently, I decided that if I wanted to continue to be with her I had no option but to accept her exactly as she is. However, after talking to other people about her actions and her difficult childhood (she was abused by her mother) I have decided that she needs therapy. I started telling her as far back as 1 year ago, but she has always accused me of telling her that she is crazy. I keep repeating that therapy is not for crazy people and I have had it myself, it helps.

Among her reckless actions, she has turns when she is angry: she screams, goes around breaking things (including the kids' things) and swears at me. Last year she kept saying that she could not stand "this sh1tty life" and that she wanted a divorce but she never told me exactly what she was unhappy about. I have a bad temper too and used to fight with her but, at the end of last year, I downloaded information about anger management and now I can control it and I do not fight back with her but I try to calm her down. She treats the girls badly too, screaming at them this is the result of her background about her mother and her unhappiness with the marriage.

I have been less than a perfect husband and this led her to her next reckless actions: about a year ago she started flirting with other men. Last summer she finally got involved with one. She thought she had found another man and told her close friends. He used her for sex and then dumped her. It was a short lived affair but still she was furious and yet she did not stop. I only found out this at Christmas time last year. In November 2012, I started suspecting she was having an affair. I confronted her early in January and she told me she was in love and that she was leaving us to go to him. Another fictitious romance. I made her feel guilty about the girls and then she started planning on taking the girls too! She has been talking about divorce, to go to this man, but I am still waiting for the papers.

Two weeks ago, partly as a result of my actions to intervene in the affair, they broke up. I want to believe that it was mutual decision but he may have dumped her as a result of his finding out about her lying to him through my actions. I believe she may have agreed because she had become religious and she may have started feeling bad about the affair. I do not know, she will not tell me for a long time. The fact that she only attracted shallow men was her own fault: she turned herself into a glamorous and dumb blonde, to attract men, and it was the men looking at her appearance only that she attracted.

Now for the part where I need to find out whether I should seek reconciliation due to the fact I want to help her with her problems in her mind and because she may have a genuine claim to me making her unhappy. Naturally she says she does not love me and she still does not repent of what she has done to her whole family, not just to me. Yet another reckless action by my wife: she took me to court (not about the divorce) and she wrote a long statement about exactly why she has been unhappy with the marriage in recent years. This document is invaluable to me to try and save our marriage as it allows me to see, through her eyes, what she never told me. I found some things, which I did, that seem to have really affected her - maybe more than they should due to her needing therapy.

If she was not happy, she should have divorced me first and then look for another man. Now I think she is scared: she has no other man and she believes she is about to lose me. I have told her I agree to the divorce and that is it. But it is really not that true, I still love her very much, she is the mother of my children and I want to keep our family together. Other men will simply not see that she needs therapy, they will only fall for her looks. I genuinely want to help her with her need for therapy and unhappiness but she has to agree to it. Also, she has to repent of what she has done and swear never to do it again. I have told her that, when she finally agrees to talk to me extensively, I will discuss with her in every detail what she wrote on that document, I will apologise where I agree and I will make all necessary changes to be a better husband and make her happy. I have started making changes, anyhow, like not getting angry and fighting with her as well as giving full help around the house, I have become a house-husband while still being the main provider.

I cannot communicate with her at present. We sleep in separate rooms and do not talk. She is furious with me for my part in the end of her fairytale romance. I will have to wait until she comes out of her affair fog and starts seeing reason and realise what she has done to all of us. I am very convincing with my sincerity but, at the moment, she completely refuses to hear me as she knows she will hear reason and the truth. I have an idea for the future to try and rekindle our relationship: I will court her again and start from zero as, effectively, I have already lost her, but many things would have to happen before. She has been rather cruel but I want to believe it is because of her problems in her mind. She was bad tempered but not cruel in the first 9 years of our marriage.

Any helpful comments and advice will be welcome. The main thing is how to pave the way for her to see, sooner rather than later I hope, that she does have a good man trying to patch things up and make her happy.

Thank you

Last edited by freddie; 1st April 2013 at 08:17 PM.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 01:14 PM   #2
Raymond
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

Crumbs Freddie you sound like a superman. Normally I would say that the marriage has ended where a wife has committed adultery and has not even repented of it.

However she obviously does have deep seated problems from her childhood which have not been overcome. Can you say what the nature of the abuse was?

To me the marriage sounds like looking after an ungrateful patient. I am amazed that you still want to try again from the start. If you can win her back great. Until you do I don't think there is much you can do just now until she can admit that she has a problem.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 02:04 PM   #3
freddie
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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Crumbs Freddie you sound like a superman. Normally I would say that the marriage has ended where a wife has committed adultery and has not even repented of it.

However she obviously does have deep seated problems from her childhood which have not been overcome. Can you say what the nature of the abuse was?

To me the marriage sounds like looking after an ungrateful patient. I am amazed that you still want to try again from the start. If you can win her back great. Until you do I don't think there is much you can do just now until she can admit that she has a problem.
Yes, I know, I am not expecting that I can resolve the matter tomorrow, plus I need her to want to repair the marriage, to repent and to seek therapy plus counselling with me. The truth is I love her (but a bit less every day) and, if she has a real argument about me neglecting her, then I am prepared to make it up to her and try again.
The abuse she suffered was she was beaten with a belt, made to kneel in the corner of a room with grain under her bare knees and she was sent to live with her grandparents for a few years, all by her own mother - she must have done other things to punish her that I do not know about yet. Sending her away was not abuse, it was because her parents could not cope but it still makes you feel unwanted.

I am trying not to make up excuses for her behaviour but still she suffered abuse as a child and I was not the best husband. She deserves another try in my view, plus she is the mother of my children and I want us to stay together (under good behaviour).

I rembember her saying that the other man treated her like a princess. Interesting word, could it be that she has always been looking for compensation for her mother not treating her like her little pirncess? and that she feels I did not do that? If it makes her a better woman, I will have no trouble spoiling her.

Last edited by freddie; 2nd April 2013 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 03:59 PM   #4
chosen
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

MY thought after reading this is that some people will never be happy no matter what you do. We cant go though life expecting to be treated like a princess. Thats not real life, nor possible, nor even good for us. She is a wife and mother to two young children, but she is acting very selfishly and in a very immature way. She is actually acting like a spolit brat, screaming and shouting and throwing her toys(literally).To some extent you are enabling her behaviour, and excusing it. Her behaviour is actually abusive, and the children will be damaged by it.

My husband was often punished with a belt, and he is the nicest, most easy going, easy to please man ever.

You seem to be blaming her affairs on the way you acted, I doubt that was the case from what you say. An affair is a decision. Those who cheat will aways blame the other person. Its human nature. She has had at least 2 already, and the liklihood is that she wont stop there. She appears to only want you when she has no one else, for security I suppose. You need to ask yourself if that is what you want. Do you want to be the fall back guy for when her affairs end? Do you want to live with a woman who lies, cheats and decieves? How can you trust her?
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Old 2nd April 2013, 04:24 PM   #5
freddie
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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MY thought after reading this is that some people will never be happy no matter what you do. We cant go though life expecting to be treated like a princess. Thats not real life, nor possible, nor even good for us. She is a wife and mother to two young children, but she is acting very selfishly and in a very immature way. She is actually acting like a spolit brat, screaming and shouting and throwing her toys(literally).To some extent you are enabling her behaviour, and excusing it. Her behaviour is actually abusive, and the children will be damaged by it.

My husband was often punished with a belt, and he is the nicest, most easy going, easy to please man ever.

You seem to be blaming her affairs on the way you acted, I doubt that was the case from what you say. An affair is a decision. Those who cheat will aways blame the other person. Its human nature. She has had at least 2 already, and the liklihood is that she wont stop there. She appears to only want you when she has no one else, for security I suppose. You need to ask yourself if that is what you want. Do you want to be the fall back guy for when her affairs end? Do you want to live with a woman who lies, cheats and decieves? How can you trust her?
Well, she has not said that she wants to come back (or stay) to me. I know it sounds like I am making up excuses for her behaviour but I do say on the first message that she should not have done what she did.
At the same time, I refuse to discard her like a fridge beyond repair. If she has a genuine problem in her head, and I contributed to it, I am there for her now. And the matter about being mistreated as a child, alone, is a reason she needs therapy urgently. Not all people can cope, like your husband, with a bad childhood like hers with the demons coming back to haunt you throughout your life. I had a bad childhood, too, and therapy helped me a lot. Therapy will do her no harm, it can only help.
You need to understand that this not just the typical cheater, she does a number of other reckless actions that all form part of the same package she has become. Something triggered her bad behaviour, in the past year or so, and that is what I am finding out.
Yes, she is acting in an extremely selfish way. She considers that she has done everything for everyone, in the past 10 years and that she has had no reward. I am told that people who end an affair do not necessarily come out of the Fog automatically. She is still in it and, as Raymond says, I need to wait until she comes out of the Fog and sees reason for herself.

Last edited by freddie; 2nd April 2013 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 04:50 PM   #6
chosen
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

Yes but she has had 2 affairs now and didnt come out of the 'fog' after the first one. I am not suggesting that you discard her, but that you set clear conditions for the marriage to carry on.
1) she gets counselling on her own, along with anger managment,
2) she stops seeing any other men and with no more chances, and
3) you get marriage counselling together.
She needs to know that her actions have consequanses.We even teach small children that.

Cant help thinking of my brother who had his wife back after 2 affairs, She went on to have 2 more and is now married to the 4th lover.

Being a mother and wife isnt something that you do to get rewards??? Having that family and those healthy kids is reward enough.I think her view of married life is skewed.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 05:51 PM   #7
freddie
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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Yes but she has had 2 affairs now and didnt come out of the 'fog' after the first one. I am not suggesting that you discard her, but that you set clear conditions for the marriage to carry on.
1) she gets counselling on her own, along with anger managment,
2) she stops seeing any other men and with no more chances, and
3) you get marriage counselling together.
She needs to know that her actions have consequanses.We even teach small children that.

Cant help thinking of my brother who had his wife back after 2 affairs, She went on to have 2 more and is now married to the 4th lover.

Being a mother and wife isnt something that you do to get rewards??? Having that family and those healthy kids is reward enough.I think her view of married life is skewed.
I absolutely agree with your point plan, but that can only happen if she wants to get back to the marriage. She is not that devious that she has told me everything is fine now that her affair ended. She says she is 'really' going to get the divorce started and I have said I will sign the papers as soon as I get them. For me to proceed with the divorce is the best chance I have (I think) for her to realise that I am never going to take any of this rubbish again.

About the rewards, what she meant was me never taking her out, not showing her appreciation for her efforts looking after the house, children and me as well standing by me in difficult times and me not showing her love and affection. She is right on these things, she did things wrong too, but men are less demanding on the sentimental side of things.

As for her having affairs, the sure way that this would happen again is if we went back to the same way we were living (that must have happened to your brother). I would tell my wife that we have to make a radical change in our relationship and lifestyle or we will not last another 6 months, before she starts looking again. She got away with it before as I trusted her 100%, I was not watching plus I had zero experience with infidelity. This time I would trust her less and would watch a lot more. Now I know all the signs of an affair. It's a risk, yes, but she did not do it in the first 9 years of our marriage so she can avoid it again if she is happy

Last edited by freddie; 2nd April 2013 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 06:33 PM   #8
Raymond
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

Although we are responsible for our actions as she is as well I can see that she has severe incapacities from her childhood. To be beaten with a belt and made to kneel on grain is really over the top. If she uses this as an excuse for her behaviour then there won't be a way forward. If she realises she needs healing then there is. I think your use of demons could be relevant here. Some bad backgrounds can haunt you for years. I don't think it is just a matter of being beaten with a belt. There was obvious cruelty going on.

You say that she has now found religion. That could be helpful so long as it is not a cult. It depends. Do you know what it is?

I really hope you get through with this one. I think she really needs you but doesn't realise it.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 07:23 PM   #9
freddie
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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Although we are responsible for our actions as she is as well I can see that she has severe incapacities from her childhood. To be beaten with a belt and made to kneel on grain is really over the top. If she uses this as an excuse for her behaviour then there won't be a way forward. If she realises she needs healing then there is. I think your use of demons could be relevant here. Some bad backgrounds can haunt you for years. I don't think it is just a matter of being beaten with a belt. There was obvious cruelty going on.

You say that she has now found religion. That could be helpful so long as it is not a cult. It depends. Do you know what it is?

I really hope you get through with this one. I think she really needs you but doesn't realise it.
The religion is nothing weird, it's only the local catholic church. I approve of it, I said to her: "go and ask god to forgive you for what you have done and ask him not to let you do it again, instead of asking him to help you get what you want". It think it got to her conscience.

She has never excused herself for her behaviour with her difficult childhood; in fact she is unaware of the connection, I am the one who found it. I am the one that realises she could not bond with her daughters properly as she is now somewhat behaving, like her mother, with her own daughters (but without the physical cruelty). That is what she needs to resolve in therapy.

I am -fairly- confident that if she goes to therapy and we go to marriage counselling, I can get back the lovely girl I married 10 years ago.

Thanks for your support

Last edited by freddie; 2nd April 2013 at 07:29 PM.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 07:29 PM   #10
chosen
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

In my brothjers case she didnt seem to have the capacity to be faithful. He is the nicest guy you could meet(and everyone says that)and a brilliant dad as well. The kids stayed with him when she upped and left. He is now very happy with a lovely lady who he has been with for about 5 years, and she seems to have morals and integrity thank goodness.

I am glad that you are being firm, as carrying on with no boundaries or conditions would be suicide on your part.

You mention that she wouldnt do that if she was happy. Well, marriage has ups and downs, and it is when things are hard that we need to carry on being faithful no matter what, and remember our vows for better or for worse.

Raymond I am not denying that childhood abuse affect us, I have three adults in my family who were sexually abused by their father, but they dont go round shouting and screaming and breaking things or running around cheating on their partners. In fact they are lovely, kind, polite and caring people. One is training to be a counsellor so that she can become a childrens counsellor and help kids who are hurting.
I sometimes think that too much is blamed on our childhoods, so that we dont need to take responsibility for our poor choices and behaviour. As joyce Meyer says(a Christian teacher, herself seriously physically, emotionally and sexually abused most of her childhood) we cant help what is done to us but we can help how we deal with it and how we act.

You are another case in point Raymond, with your good marriage and nice kids.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 07:41 PM   #11
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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The religion is nothing weird, it's only the local catholic church. I approve of it, I said to her: "go and ask god to forgive you for what you have done and ask him not to let you do it again, instead of asking him to help you get what you want". It think it got to her conscience.

She has never excused herself for her behaviour with her difficult childhood; in fact she is unaware of the connection, I am the one who found it. I am the one that realises she could not bond with her daughters properly as she is now somewhat behaving, like her mother, with her own daughters (but without the physical cruelty). That is what she needs to resolve in therapy.

I am -fairly- confident that if she goes to therapy and we go to marriage counselling, I can get back the lovely girl I married 10 years ago.

Thanks for your support
I sincerely hope that she will see the light and agree to what she needs to get past this. I suppose its a bit like an alchoholic in that she will need to admit that she needs help before she will do anything about it. At this time she merely blames it all on you, which isnt helping anyone.

If she does go through with the divorce, I think you need to fight to have those girls with you. Otherwise the whole cycle will carry on with them and their own children. Anger, screaming, shouting, throwing and breaking things is a horrible fearful atmosphere to have to live in, and an abusive one, and once on her own she may get worse with them, and also bring all sorts of men back. They have to be your no 1 priority now.

As for the divorce, you can do all sorts of things to stall it if that is what you want. However if she is determined to do it, then why fight it? If she is R. Catholic, they will not support a divorce under any circumstances, and will tell her she can not remarry.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 08:15 PM   #12
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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I sincerely hope that she will see the light and agree to what she needs to get past this. I suppose its a bit like an alchoholic in that she will need to admit that she needs help before she will do anything about it. At this time she merely blames it all on you, which isnt helping anyone.

If she does go through with the divorce, I think you need to fight to have those girls with you. Otherwise the whole cycle will carry on with them and their own children. Anger, screaming, shouting, throwing and breaking things is a horrible fearful atmosphere to have to live in, and an abusive one, and once on her own she may get worse with them, and also bring all sorts of men back. They have to be your no 1 priority now.

As for the divorce, you can do all sorts of things to stall it if that is what you want. However if she is determined to do it, then why fight it? If she is R. Catholic, they will not support a divorce under any circumstances, and will tell her she can not remarry.
Yes but we did not marry in the church and she is a sort of converted catholic (when she is in trouble). She is orignally Eastern European orthodox church.

I know the girls should be my first priority. She is already under enormous stress with a new job which she would need if she fought to keep the girls. The stress would be doubled if she had to look after the girls and that would end up in real abuse on them. I have no trouble, I work from home and can look after them, but I still need my wife. We really need each other. Isn't that what marriage is supposed to be about?
If we divorce, I will fight like a mad dog to keep the girls. She had told me that the other man was prepared to take her with the girls. I told her that her taking the girls from me and handing them over to the bugger would never happen.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 10:37 PM   #13
chosen
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

Yes I know that you need her, but in a marriage it takes 2. if she is determined to end the marriage you can stall it for a while, but in the end you cant stop it. Time will tell what will happen, but if she wants out then what can you do?
I honestly doubt she will divorce you unless she finds another man who is prepared to take her on.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 11:02 PM   #14
freddie
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

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Yes I know that you need her, but in a marriage it takes 2. if she is determined to end the marriage you can stall it for a while, but in the end you cant stop it. Time will tell what will happen, but if she wants out then what can you do?
I honestly doubt she will divorce you unless she finds another man who is prepared to take her on.
Well I am not going to continue to look after her while she finds another man so she will have to decide which course she wants now. And remember that this is not just about she and I, it is about 4 people including our children.

Well yes she (and I) want out of this marriage as it has become but what if we can bring it back to the days of bliss? why can't we?

I normally see in this forums that it is all about the cheater and the betrayed spouse, little or nothing about the children. They should have their say. They are treated like who is going to keep the car.
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Old 2nd April 2013, 11:29 PM   #15
chosen
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Re: How to see our married life through my wife's eyes

As I said to you earlier, the children need to be your first priority. They are the innocent victims. So I agree totally with what you say.

Marriages can be restored and improved, but only IF both spouses are prepared to do everything they can to work on it, admit their own faults and make that 100% committment to the marriage.
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