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Old 16th April 2011, 02:41 PM   #31
Chamomile
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Re: Help

So in a way, my question is, when to "give up" and when to retain "hope" and try to work on it?

It would be harder to force a grown man to do what his w wants if he's unhappy with something in his marriage. Perhaps, he isn't unhappy as such..he might have chosen to ignore boundaries to please himself?
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Old 16th April 2011, 07:14 PM   #32
Raymond
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Re: Help

The difference is if he is trying to give up and needs help or if he has no intention of giving up and wants to get away with as much as he can. It is mental adultery. Personally I think that lust is wanting what is not rightfully yours. Lust for one's wife is good although I wouldn't call that lust.

These people are just cheating on their wives and their marriages. Once you do that it changes the bedroom intimacy as you are bringing others into the equation including even porn. I think wives should confront at the first sign of anything like this as it can lead to devastation of the intimacy a wife and husband should enjoy together. Some men will try to get away with what they can or what the wife will let them. A good marriage cannot exist with this going on.
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Old 16th April 2011, 07:50 PM   #33
Chamomile
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Re: Help

It's always Good to hear your opinion on this. I don't see many other Men speaking out on this so clearly. (Maybe, men tend to have more empathy towards other men and accept their action more ?)
It would be heartbreaking if wife finds his tracks on those "hook-up" sites...
would be even more embarrassing if relative saw it first and tell you..
I also agree that using internet sites looking for some excitement really seems to be a deadly symptom of "I'm not getting this at home so I'm getting this from else where", which would probably accelerate the marriage further going down.
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Old 17th April 2011, 09:52 AM   #34
Raymond
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Re: Help

I think they are robbing themselves as well as their wives. What they do can drastically affect the intimacy of their own bedrooms which should be sacrosanct. People who do that neglect their marriages and their wives in certain areas. They know it is wrong and that is why most of them try to hide it. Wives have a duty not to be refuser's (and husbands too) not that anything justifies porn, but it could open them to temptation.
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Old 17th April 2011, 12:14 PM   #35
Chamomile
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Re: Help

Raymond, it's Good that you have been the shining light on this site.

Until I came to this site, didn't realize how complex marriage really is and how much work that would take. Since, I decided to have another go in my marriage. Sometimes, the prospect of repairing is so daunting and I'd appreciate that a lot of people would simply give up instead of painstakingly trying to rebuild what's been broken.

I'm sure porn is a big problem in many households. When the marriage isn't looking too good then one can imagine, fantasy is looking much better.
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Old 18th April 2011, 10:04 AM   #36
Raymond
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Re: Help

Fantasy can lead to a wilderness in the marriage arena Chamomile. Having vision and dreams are good and can inspire us to better things. Fantasy breaks down relationship and isolates. The bedroom is a wonderful place where there is love and faithfulness.

We are supposed to do each other good and the very least I can do is to keep myself pure for her. Mentally and physically. I know marriage is much more than sex but break it there and the marriage is in jeopardy.
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Old 18th April 2011, 08:51 PM   #37
Heather
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Re: Help

Hunny - my heart goes out to you in all of this. So much of what you say has echoed in my ears over the last 12 months.

Firstly, you are not alone... in your situation or in the way you feel. so many of us here know exactly what you are going through.

Second, don't be afraid to give yourself time. Don't feel that you have to know what to do right now. I know you want answers, from your husband.. anyone really... but your answers will come from inside you as you gradually work through all that has happened. At the moment you are in shock. The man you have loved and trusted has gone, to be replaced by someone you don't even know - and yet he looks at you the same way, laughs with you, carries on his life as though everything is normal. It is as though someone has died - and yet they are right there with you and you can't move on.

I was frozen for a long time, in that moment of shock and hurt.

It will pass in time, you have a lot to think about and accept as you find out about this stranger you are with... hurt to overcome...tears to cry (I never realised I had so many)...anger and frustration...shame (which comes even though you have done nothing wrong...it is part of the deal). The list seem endless.

I know my friends gave me lots of help and advice - on this site and in my life - but ultimately they have had to support me while I worked it out my way.

I wish I could move you forward in time to see how things will work out and that life will get better. Hang in there Hunny, have faith in yourself...even if that faith is tiny at the moment. You are precious, worthy of the love and respect of someone who values you, not a man who would cheat, lie and destroy you. Find that tiny flicker of strength in you that is hiding deep at the moment and trust that you will come through - you will work it all out and it will get better.

You are in my thoughts.x
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Old 19th April 2011, 11:38 AM   #38
Helen_uk
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Re: Help

Heather,
that is an excellent post and so , so true.

When you're going through this it feels like the whole world is telling you you should leave . Yes, in reality you probably should... but you have to reach that conclusion for yourself or you run the risk of keep going back.

I think violence is the only case where it can be said definitively that leaving immediately is the only option , for everything else where there is no danger to physical well being I think it takes time to come to the realization that a marriage is over.

It took me 3 years to find the strength and courage to end what was a very toxic relationship , not violent but damaging emotionally. During that time everyone I knew kept telling me it was no good for me, they were right, but each time I was persuaded and kicked him out or left I went back because I wasn't ready to let go .

Everyone has a breaking point though and I finally reached mine. I was heartbroken for a while even then but I didn't take him back and have since gone on to find a new relationship and more importantly to be happy and secure.

Hunny , when you're ready you'll know and meantime keep posting when you need support .
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Old 19th April 2011, 11:56 AM   #39
Chamomile
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Re: Help

[QUOTE=Raymond;61668]Fantasy can lead to a wilderness in the marriage arena Chamomile. Having vision and dreams are good and can inspire us to better things. Fantasy breaks down relationship and isolates. The bedroom is a wonderful place where there is love and faithfulness.

We are supposed to do each other good and the very least I can do is to keep myself pure for her. Mentally and physically. I know marriage is much more than sex but break it there and the marriage is in jeopardy.[/QUOTE]

Dear Raymond

I agree, it's not at all pleasant when one's partner is lusting after some digital imagery (a pure fantasy)!! I realize that men are programmed to seek "variety" they say (?)but when men suppress that potential for his faith, then imho, he is a Good Man.
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Old 19th April 2011, 12:48 PM   #40
chosen
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Re: Help

[QUOTE=Chamomile;61691]Dear Raymond

I agree, it's not at all pleasant when one's partner is lusting after some digital imagery (a pure fantasy)!! I realize that men are programmed to seek "variety" they say (?)but when men suppress that potential for his faith, then imho, he is a Good Man.[/QUOTE]

I am really not sure that men are programmed to seek variety, in one way. I believe that came about as a result of the fall, when sin entered into the equation.Dh and I were discussing that the other day as it happens.
Gods will is for us all to be faithfull and monogamous, and I believe that with His help this is the only way to be truly happy and at peace.
In proverbs it says that God will bless those who are faithful to their spouses(which presumably means that those who arent wont be blessed.
Porn, like any other sexual sin, will grow the more it is fed, and will wither when it is starved, sort of like a fire.
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Old 19th April 2011, 12:49 PM   #41
Raymond
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Re: Help

I think it is a convenient lie that men are programmed for variety Chamomile. One is not surpressing something good when one is faithful but something that is your enemy as well as hers. If a man wants a good marriage then he needs to cultivate right thinking and habits. Adultery is ugly and unfaithful. Any brief pleasure taken from it is at the expense of something far more precious and affects the wellbeing of the wife/husband and children also.

Do you still have doubts about it?
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Old 19th April 2011, 08:04 PM   #42
Chamomile
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Re: Help

[QUOTE=chosen;61694]I am really not sure that men are programmed to seek variety, in one way. I believe that came about as a result of the fall, when sin entered into the equation.Dh and I were discussing that the other day as it happens.
Gods will is for us all to be faithfull and monogamous, and I believe that with His help this is the only way to be truly happy and at peace.
In proverbs it says that God will bless those who are faithful to their spouses(which presumably means that those who arent wont be blessed.
Porn, like any other sexual sin, will grow the more it is fed, and will wither when it is starved, sort of like a fire.[/QUOTE]

I have looked at different studies and articles. Different articles seem to give us different opinions, which may be all worth bearing in mind. (more pills to swallow for me lol)

I seem to have read somewhere that someone with a bigger sexual endowment is actually a slave to his own high sexual needs. I reckon, each case has a set of different underlying causes for cheating and cheating may be a far more complex phenomena than we tend to assume?
Certainly, I'd much like to stick to the teachings of Our Father.
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Old 19th April 2011, 08:10 PM   #43
Chamomile
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Re: Help

[QUOTE=Raymond;61695]I think it is a convenient lie that men are programmed for variety Chamomile. One is not surpressing something good when one is faithful but something that is your enemy as well as hers. If a man wants a good marriage then he needs to cultivate right thinking and habits. Adultery is ugly and unfaithful. Any brief pleasure taken from it is at the expense of something far more precious and affects the wellbeing of the wife/husband and children also.

Do you still have doubts about it?[/QUOTE]

I try to keep my eyes and ears open for the truths. These things seem to happen quite often. I agree with you totally. It's often Good to discuss these things with one's spouse openly from time to time.
I spoke to my h this evening re. this. He reassured me that would be the least worry for me.
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Old 19th April 2011, 08:29 PM   #44
Helen_uk
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Re: Help

Porn is also dangerous for the libido . Men ( and women ) who regularly or obsessively view it find they need more and more stimulus to be able to have normal sex with a partner.

The availability of porn these days is something lots of people struggle to control. Not just that but the type of pornography available on the net caters for those with what are more dangerous fetishes , such as paedophilia . It's a small step from viewing the " barely legal " sites to the sites where it is indeed children being shown. If someone becomes bored with moderate porn they are then more likely to go searching for something more exciting ( to them ) , it's a slippery slope.

For myself ,I struggled for a long while with a partner who couldn't go one day without accessing porn online. He lied constantly about it and was very secretive. My self confidence hit an all time low . Our sex life suffered and eventually it lead to him seeking live thrills with a young woman . This took place over a number of years ... To him porn viewing was normal , to me the secrecy involved and the sheer amount of viewing he ended up doing meant I was left feeling unworthy .

When he finally started seeing a young woman of 18 ( I then saw sense and we split up ) I started to wonder just how young he was prepared to go ( he was almost 40 ) and thinking back over our relationship, it was always young women that attracted him... Recently , 4 years after we split , I have found out just how young he DID go. To say I'm appalled is an understatement. He is however being prosecuted for it . Thankfully.
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Old 21st April 2011, 11:16 AM   #45
Chamomile
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Re: Help

[QUOTE=Helen_uk;61705]Porn is also dangerous for the libido . Men ( and women ) who regularly or obsessively view it find they need more and more stimulus to be able to have normal sex with a partner.

The availability of porn these days is something lots of people struggle to control.

For myself ,I struggled for a long while with a partner who couldn't go one day without accessing porn online. He lied constantly about it and was very secretive. My self confidence hit an all time low . Our sex life suffered and eventually it lead to him seeking live thrills with a young woman . This took place over a number of years ... To him porn viewing was normal , to me the secrecy involved and the sheer amount of viewing he ended up doing meant I was left feeling unworthy .

When he finally started seeing a young woman of 18 ( I then saw sense and we split up ) I started to wonder just how young he was prepared to go ( he was almost 40 ) and thinking back over our relationship, it was always young women that attracted him... Recently , 4 years after we split , I have found out just how young he DID go. To say I'm appalled is an understatement. He is however being prosecuted for it . Thankfully.[/QUOTE]

Helen

I often notice people on this site have had their own share of dreadful misery through unthinkable misfortune.
Certainly, it's your strength of character which I so admire, that you were able to write these.

I often wondered if Porn availability is based on the sheer demand and supply principle. Men have their financial power and they have sex drive and it's an easy trap for them (?) But anything in that nature, I really don't know much about. Surely your ex must have known that he would be traced back for viewing such illegal materials?

You have gone through such a traumatic time over a number of years. Yes, it does seem to take time to come to closure, that I often notice in other people's posts and mine lol You were so brave that you moved on and found a Good relationship. Again, that shows your strength of character.

Enjoy the sunny day
Thanks for sharing Helen
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