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Old 26th January 2010, 03:29 PM   #61
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Hi All, im just having a bad day myself. If one thing, I noticed a pattern with my bad days. So, I tired to prepare myself as best as possible.

On Sunday night, I told my wife that I need to know a few days in advance if she wants me to sleep elsewhere. In reality, I do not need that but by talking about the future and when we will see each other again lets me paint a picture of us together again. On Sunday, she wanted me to stay with her and she was trying to decide if I "should stay or should I go?" No joke, she was singing the song. (Like I said, we both kinda joke at our situation to keep it from getting to tense) I know inside, I immediately felt low. Really low. I think my wife sensed it and held me.

I know this incredible woman cares for me. She cant stand to see me hurting. Though in some respects, I dont think she cant handle anyone hurting. Thats what makes her a fantastic nurse, Fantastic mother, and fantastic wife. Even last night, she was crying. She was asking out loud why is she so screwed up. IM trying everything in my power to build her up. Im not blowing smoke up her rear end. Im being completely honest about what she means to me, what she means to the kids, what she means to her friends and family. And I start crying.

Not crying because of my situation. Im crying solely because my wife is feeling so low. In that instance, I look at my wife as I have some tears building in my eyes and I see this glimmer of confidence. I've seen it before but it kinda caught me off guard. So I decided to say something. I told her what i noticed inside her. That when she saw me crying, she went from being down and hurt, to a compassionate feeling person. (Ok maybe not in those words. It was like, for one instance, I saw that glimmer of confidence in her because she was taking care of something (me).
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Old 26th January 2010, 06:11 PM   #62
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Im making a proclamation. I am going to love unconditionally. I dont require anything in return. I will do everything in my power to love. My wife, my kids, my house, my family, my god. I think I've realized for the longest time that I didnt really love myself and I let that attitude come between everyone I loved. Unfortunately, I didnt see it that way at first. Now im truly healing.

No doubt Im going to cry. Hell, I was just "chatting" with my wife on messenger. I was almost ready to cry as she sent me a message. It feels good to know she is thinking of me. Even if its to tell me something trivial of her day. I told her that it makes me feel good that she notices what Im doing around the house. I also told her that the reason it makes me feel good is not because she notices but because I can tell she feels even the slightest bit better that Im making an effort.

I did tear up while i was chatting with her. Thankfully there is no webcam to capture the tears that swell in my eyes. Again, not tears for pain but tears for healing and love. I've come to realize that tears are not always a negative thing. Being a man, its not always easy to see anything that way. I was brought up to be strong, emotionally stable. Though I dont feel as strong and stable as I have in the past, I do realize that I do feel happier in general. Despite my situation with my wife.

The yo-yo that has been my emotional and spiritual ride is continuing. No doubt it will be even harder tonight and tomorrow as I wont be able to hold my wife and help my children with the myriad of homework they each have. I have some concerns that my wife will feel stressed at the amount of work my oldest has. Not sure how I can get my daughter to work on her book report while im on the phone with her but Im going to give it a whirl.

Its time to make life more worth living through love.
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Old 26th January 2010, 10:38 PM   #63
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

So im nearing the end of the work day. I've probably talked to my wife more than I did before this entire mess started. IM NOT COMPLAINING

However, I am already feeling low energy and down in general. I've decided to head to the gym and I know Ill be seeing a few of my friends while I play some basketball. Of course, most of the time, I knew my wife would be there and the kids would be in the day care as she worked out. I would search her out and we would just talk to between different exercises. Maybe even plan dinner. My wife hasn't been going to the gym as much as she used to. Im hoping to god its not because of me. I get sad thinking about what I do after the gym. Most of the time, as soon as I was leaving, id call my wife to say im on my way home and see if she needed anything at the store.

This time, I wont be making the short ride to my house and my family. I will be taking an hour long ride to my parents house. I still may call. My wife said to call her on my way from the gym. though I'm trying to figure out if she was saying that to be nice or if she wants to talk. Either way, I need to talk to my kids.

I'm feeling out of sorts with this and really hope my wife sees that I'm willing to make lifelong commitment changes. I told her today that as much as things appear broken that I do feel closer in some respects. Though I did caution that by saying, that's how I feel and im not sure how she feels. I can only see that she appreciates the effort Im making.
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Old 26th January 2010, 11:54 PM   #64
Ageing Grace
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Oliver, your posts are amazing and moving. I so hope things work out for both of you!
Why does she think she's "screwed up"?
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Old 27th January 2010, 02:06 PM   #65
Raymond
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Good point. Why does she say that?

You are doing fantastic things Oliver. Committed to loving unconditionally is amazing. It all has to be worked out in practice of course but having the committment is half the battle.

What is the problem now with her? How can you help her with the way she is?

Raymond
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Old 27th January 2010, 03:01 PM   #66
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Thanks for responding. I appreciate the feedback. I believe that when I write my comments here, I am committed to feeling them outwardly as well. I used to wake up in the morning and just go through the motions. This was something even my wife said during the last month. Unfortunately, she was using that as measuring stick on the love between us. Upon reflection, I was going through the motions. I was taking things for granted.

On why does she think she is screwed up? I guess thats part of the million dollar question. I have my own thoughts on that but it is scary to think about. However, I know realize what she is going through in many aspects. I couldnt see the clearing through the forest. The fog (or as I told my therapist, my funk) is awfully hard to see through at times. I've been mired in depression for months. For me, it was at various levels. I had major mood swings. The reason things were so bad in our family life was that I was really just in survivor mode. Make it to the next day had become my mantra. Unfortunately, my "funks" lasted longer and longer and were pushed deeper due to the stress caused by our finances and X-mas. Also, I was beginning to see signs of stress in our relationship. More like she was slowly withdrawing. It was about month and half ago that I mentioned that I was not jealous of her going out with her friends. But I was jealous that the time she was spending with her friends didnt include me. It was a turning point in my mind. It may have been a turning point for my wife as well. I'm not positive about the following statement. However, it is quite possible had I not cried my eyes out to her at that time, that she would have completely withdrawn from me. I think at that time, it created a seedling for her to think about. As i mentioned, I was never a free talker when it came to my emotions and the pain I was feeling. I did ask her about it the other night and it really confirmed my suspicions that she had thought this out before. My therapist asked if this was a blindside moment. In many respects it was. However we had talked about this for 3 days before we actually did this. In the most unselfish thing I've probably done in my life. I told her not to worry about me and the hurt it could cause me. I truly want her to be happy. (And praying to the Lord almighty that I am the one that makes her happy) I also realized that it probably wouldn't be fair to me if she was in our marriage if she didnt have loving feelings towards me.

In many ways, my wife is feeling the same stress that I was. Like I've read in many post, the decision to have me live at my parents house was probably thought out in advance. I mean I know she would say it sometimes in a joking manner. However, it was probably my wife trying to feel out how to say something that was difficult for her.

So getting back to why my wife feels that she is so screwed up. I think she realizes that a lot of the pressures we feel are due to our the strain our finances (or lack of finances. LOL) cause us. I think she feels guilty about the purchase of the new house we are in. However, I think a lot of her thinking is based on why she feels so low at the moment. Why it is scary to me is that I think she is on the see-saw when it comes to her love for me. The good news is that I think I made the decision more difficult for her based on what I've been doing for the last month or two. I hoping that she is not having the following conversation in her head.

"Why dont I love this guy (in that way) who is trying so hard to change. I know I wasn't sure how much he loved me but he really is SHOWING me how much he loves me and how much he cares for me. " Thats what Im dreading.

The good news last night (well good news to me I think) was we were messaging on our phones. (I equate this to the old school sending messages in class) We had already talked on the phone and she was sitting in bed watching TV or trying to go to sleep. I told her she has any trouble sleeping and wants to talk that I'll be there for her. About an 2 hours later, I was updating my status on Facebook to confess my love for NyQuil. (I'm fighting a cold at the moment). within seconds of me posting this update, she calls me. I ask her if everything is ok thinking there was an emergency of some type going on and she just said she was having trouble sleeping and that she wanted to call me.

I'll admit, I had a big smile on my face. I playfully told asked her if she was thinking of me and missing me and she said she was. The call didnt last long. It was probably the 3rd time that we just kept saying I love you and goodnight. There were plenty of hopeful messages as well. Only time will tell as they say.
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Old 27th January 2010, 08:39 PM   #67
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

well, I just had an interesting conversation with my wife and it leaves me confused, pleased, hurt all in one. I guess when you start talking about your feelings, things will just come out. For me, I've been doing this for a month straight now. I know its making a difference.

Today, two of my kids were complaining of being sick. They have coughs, and runny noses and sore throats. My wife kept them all home from school. We already had one appointment scheduled for the baby so throwing one more on wouldnt be a problem. I've talked to my wife couple of times and once before she took a shower. The difference in her attitude was amazing. Apparently when she was in the shower, my oldest girls decided to trash the living room. Not in a malicious way, but made the room a complete mess.

My wife exploded on them. It was a knee jerk reaction and I could tell immediately when she had called me that trouble was brewing. She dumps on me. Not what I did but just an emotional dumping of why she is sick and tired of everything going on. She told me that I can come over after work as she will need some space from the kids. She had a hair appointment scheduled but wasn't sure she was going to that and of course mentioned she might see what her cousin is doing.

I didnt say a word. I just said im sorry that she is having such a bad day. I learned that she also talked to another friend of hers about our situation. This girl was part of our relationship from the very beginning. She was my wifes close friend when we started dating up until we moved from massachusetts. Still close enough to drive but they ended up not seeing each that much. This friend 2 weeks ago said she wasn't surprised that my wife was having problems with me stating that "he was always a little immature". Man did that sting. Of course, she doesn't recall the times she was boinking my best friend even while she was engaged. Sorry, I dont hate her. im just lashing out at frustration.

The news I heard today from my wife is that she now believes we need to spend time together to make sure she still has feelings for me. I think she realizes that most of our problems have been the lack of time spent together. (Hence why my fear of this so called space). If I had left with no contact, we would be over right now. I have no doubts about that right now. Im guessing her friend explained to her that we need time together to confirm her feelings for me. So in some sense, I feel better but the next ball is now in the air. I am trying to temper her expectations of our time together. Knowing full well that one or two days together cannot heal any of the emotional scars that each of us may be carrying with us. Though I also recognize this is a start.

She also told me that she knows that the grass isnt greener on the other side. Once again more positive news for us. We talked about the times where she really detested me. Sadly, I never felt that she disliked me or hated being around me. I guess she was good at hiding her feelings as well. I could actually feel her venom over the phone as we were talking about it. I just agreed with her and told her how much I realized I as arse. That and I told her that I love her very much. That we need time together to rebuild.
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Old 27th January 2010, 09:25 PM   #68
Raymond
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

I think you are gradually winning the battle by the sound of it Oliver. I am encouraged that you pray. Has he not said I am an ever present help in time of need? If you are going to live a loving life you need to be filled up with His love. I often get to a place where I have to be filled up again. I do it unconsciously sometimes. There is a proverb that says a three ply cord is not easily broken. I always take that to mean husband, wife and God. Is he not the creator of marriage? He should know how to fix it. We all have weaknesses but He says my strength is made perfect in weakness. You can do a lot worse things than getting built up in your faith. It is part of the answer in my view.

Raymond
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Old 27th January 2010, 10:09 PM   #69
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
I think you are gradually winning the battle by the sound of it Oliver. I am encouraged that you pray. Has he not said I am an ever present help in time of need? If you are going to live a loving life you need to be filled up with His love. I often get to a place where I have to be filled up again. I do it unconsciously sometimes. There is a proverb that says a three ply cord is not easily broken. I always take that to mean husband, wife and God. Is he not the creator of marriage? He should know how to fix it. We all have weaknesses but He says my strength is made perfect in weakness. You can do a lot worse things than getting built up in your faith. It is part of the answer in my view.

Raymond
Completely agree. It is my main reason to start the routine with my kids. I have invited my wife. (Who coincidentally is the reason I reconnected with my faith before marriage) I think she too could benefit by going to church and I wanted her to know how much better it makes me feel, (although at times I feel really low as well).
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Old 28th January 2010, 09:41 AM   #70
Raymond
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Funny I picked up a book on marriage last night that I hadn't read for a while by Derek Prince and this is what it said.

"One last word on this subject: Never again rely solely on your own effort and ability to make your marriage a success. No marriage can ever be what God intends it to be apart from His supernatural grace. The commitment you have now made to your mate and your marriage has made that grace available to you in a measure that you have never known before. Avail yourself of it freely! God has told us, "My grace is suffiicient for you, for power is perfected in weakness" (2 Cor 12:9). God's grace and power will see you through every difficulty that arises. If you feel perplexed, discouraged, or inadequate, trust God for an extra measure of grace and power, right then and there. Expect to see Him work - in ways, perhaps, you could never have imagined. Expect to see Him change whatever needs to be changed - you, your mate, the whole situation. He will not fail you".

I have found that true in my marriage and believe that is the main reason for the success of it, certainly not my background.

Raymond
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Old 28th January 2010, 11:22 PM   #71
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Thanks Raymond. I will need even more inspiration today. i will provide an update shortly...
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Old 29th January 2010, 10:40 AM   #72
Ageing Grace
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Once again, thank you for your posts, Oliver. It's both interesting and inspiring to hear about your learning process and how you & your wife are becoming more open to yourselves and to one another. The overriding point, for me, is how well you have learned to listen attentively and sympathetically. You're becoming a good friend to your wife, aren't you?
Wishing you all the inspiration you need.
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Old 29th January 2010, 02:30 PM   #73
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Thanks Grace.

Remember some of my previous post that I said my wife had spent time on facebook and chatting with an old boyfriend (back when she was 13). Well, I was right about my gut. Wrong about the timing. My wife finally revealed that she did have an emotional affair and did kiss this other guy. She didnt go into great detail nor did I want all the details. In many respects, I had already determined that and regardless, it wasn't changing what I needed to do to be a better person, a better father, and a better husband.

Will be posting later.
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Old 29th January 2010, 02:58 PM   #74
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

I guess something in the back of my head always knew something went on. However, I didnt go looking for evidence all the time. I do know (because she told me) that they talked on the phone, text messaged and chatted on facebook. They only met up together once. If there was a saving grace, they were caught kissing by a friend of this other's guys wife. I say that but possibly my wife will reveal more to me.

I am looking at it this way. I've been beating myself up over how much I pushed her away. I was completely relaxed. My wife had gone out the night she told me. I was kinda hoping she would come home earlier as I was trying to plan a relaxing massage for her. We kissed. I thought it was deep. I was shocked at my own reaction to the news. It hurt. I felt inviscerated to my core.

More to come.
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Old 30th January 2010, 01:24 AM   #75
koliver0821
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Re: Understanding the need for Space?

Now to add more to what I am feeling. How is it that I've contstantly said to my wife that If she ever cheated on me, Id be bitter and angry and make her life hell? In fact, in early December, my wife and I were talking about the movie Hangover where the girl cheated on her husband. She was a raving BI.... My wife started crying at the movie and said she cant believe that she acted like a jealous bitc... when we were dating. It led to a conversation about cheating again. She couldnt believe that I could be that cold if someone (or in this case she) was to ever cheat on me. I called it the ultimate betrayal. However, I backed off that comment. Even before she asked for space, I had told her that I wasn't really sure if thats how I felt. I guess part of me was trying to see if she would admit to cheating on me. Hell she even begged me to ask her. So I did. And she lied and told me that she hadn't and couldn't actually believe I was asking.

Funny how that works. She was trying to make me feel guilty for asking when she knew that she had. In the night of this revelation, all these details were flowing in my head. How screwed up this.

I told her that as much as I may be hurt by hearing this tonight, I told her that she was going to feel better. I must have said it 10 times. I was hurting. Alot. I really didnt show it until the morning after. I didnt sleep at all. I tried but I couldnt. I cried a lot and I made her see the hurt but told her I was sorry for pushing her away. I also told her that despite all the stuff I said about cheating, I am unconditionally in love with her. That if this affair, that has been broken off for some time now, was a block in the way of her getting better, then I can live with it assuming she is willing to work on communicating with me and rebuilding our relationship.

I told her I was new person. That despite all the hurt I may be feeling and outwardly showing, that I feel stronger. I literally cannot get the smile off my face today. I owe that all to my therapist. Truly not because he told me anything specific. But when I left, I felt tired. I played some indoor soccer and came home. My wife who told me a few hours before that she would be sleeping, was actually awake. She was in our bed. I bought a bottle of wine at the store and some other items for the kids that we would need. I drank one glass of wine right away. Poured myself a second glass and went upstairs to talk. Not about us, but to talk about my night. She was laughing at me when she saw the wine and was kinda surprised. I told her that red wine makes me feel warm. Of course, the nurse in my wife told me that it was a depressant and with the history of alcoholism in my family, I should be careful. But I didnt care. I felt great and was really only drinking the wine to wind up the day. We didnt talk much more after that. We slept and held each other all night.

We had couples therapy today and I was completely jittery. Combination of nerves and 2 cups of coffee without eating anything. In that meeting, I was feeling upbeat. Not because of anything I was hearing, but I realized I was better person already. That ready to talk about myfeelings that I so desperately kept guarded for so long. I kind felt beat up the last time we went to couples therapy. Everything my wife said was negative towards me. But its funny when the first thing I get to mention is my wife's affair. Then all of the sudden, the environment changed. I could genuinely feel that my wife was making an effort. I truly believed that this guilt shes been having for so long about the affair was eating at her.

My wife was concerned before we spoke to our therapist because she thought she was too cold. What a difference a week makes! She actually likes our therapist. I agree that she is a little cold but I suppose as a therapist, your constantly being dumped on emotionally so you dont actually take in what people are feeling. Only the manner in which the message is being delivered. She of course misunderstood my reason for talking. I was so full of energy and all positive energy. I truly didnt care of my wife and I couldnt' work it out. I realized one way or the other, I will be a better person regardless of the outcome.

Now with that being said, Im praying hard that we work out cause I know for sure she is my soulmate. The small kiss she gave me before leaving for work and just the positive energy she was giving towards me really made me feel something. I asked her if she was feeling better? She told me she was feeling a little better. I already knew the answer. I just wanted to have her say it. She was looking fantastic, even though she will be starting the first of 3 12 hour shifts overnight.
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