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Old 22nd September 2013, 10:53 AM   #91
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

I would say that the best is yet to come. Finally she is changing and learning and showing love, and that is brilliant. Encourage that and act out that love no matter how you feel.

Many who have affairs do so because of the excitement, the hidden secret attraction(usually physical) and the lust. This isn't real life. Its not what real relationships are all about. Even if you had left your wife for the OW, do you honestly think that would have lasted? Of course not. The excitement would have died down, the lust would have settled and your life with her would have got normal and ordinary just as much of our lives is. The guilt would have troubled you,and your relationships with your children would probably have been badly affected as they felt terribly rejected by you. You would have found out each other bad habits and faults and weaknesses. Any relationship that begins with one or both leaving their spouses rarely last for obvious reasons. Fantasises are not real, they are what we make them.

I would never advise anyone to marry out of pity or because they feel sorry for them. You cant marry someone and hope they will change because you have to accept people as they are where they are. My MIL married my FIL because she felt sorry for him, and the marriage was never happy and they more or less lived separate lives till eventually they divorced.

I agree with you about Joyce Meyers husband Raymond. He was a very strong Christian and he did go through hell with her for many years. All credit to him for sticking with her and now they have been very happily married for about 45 years.


Sunny I am not entirely without sympathy, but we do need to stich with out promises to our spouse unless there is cheating or similar. OK you probably shouldn't have married her, but you did, you now have lovely children together, and you need to make the best of it as you can, instead of still longing for this unreal relationship with a women who, to be honest, you know little about. She only showed you what she wanted you to see. The feelings you had were probably merely physical attraction and for her to try and make you leave your wife was so wrong no matter what she felt.
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Old 22nd September 2013, 01:52 PM   #92
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

It may be a very good idea for you to look for another job away from the OW as well.
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Old 22nd September 2013, 09:16 PM   #93
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

I think there is a lot of hope for you both sunny. I admire you for not allowing the relationship with the OW to progress into anything physical. So many today would have just let that happen, regardless of children, so you clearly have good morals and are a caring father.

Your wife clearly feels much better emotionally and is making a real effort in the marriage. Having a wife who really loves you unconditionally and passionately is a thing that many people never have, so that alone is a blessing even if at this time you don't feel the same. You did have many difficult years so give it time.

I am glad that talking about it has helped. It can be very therapeutic to do that, and also to know that some else cares.
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Old 23rd September 2013, 12:05 PM   #94
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

That's great news Sunny. If you have resisted this you will be able to resist most things that try to destroy your marriage and family. With Chosen I do believe the best is to come. I do think you need friendship as well but a friendship that doesn't weaken your marriage but helps build you up as a person.
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Old 24th September 2013, 09:52 AM   #95
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

Sunny its a pleasure, and we are always here if you need to ask more questions or just want to off load. We are not marriage experts by any means(!) but can hopefully help just by listening and giving advise based on our own experiences and what we have seen and learnt in our lives.
I wish you every blessing in your marriage and would love to hear how things progress.
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Old 24th September 2013, 12:47 PM   #96
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

All credit to you Sunny. You have really thought about your actions and sought counselling and in my mind have come up with the right and only moral decision. Faithfulness counts for an awful lot in this cheating world. Well done.
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Old 2nd October 2013, 05:39 AM   #97
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

Dont feel bad for not being the same as Joyce Meyers husband. He was one man and you are a different man. We are all different.
I am wondering if you have depression that may benefit from seeing the doctor? If you are depressed it stops you from feeling emotions to any large degree.

Also give it time. This turnaround is very recent. You know a large part of a good long marriage is companionship. If your spouse can be your best friend and companion though life that's a blessing.
What you had (or though you had) with the OW, wasn't real life. The attraction that you felt was intense because it was new and exciting and forbidden. That too would have died down, and once it did, the day to day living/working/sleeping etc would have been far more routine. You remember it with such powerful feelings, because it never got past that initial attraction phase and into real every day life, so you can make it what you want it to be in you mind.

I can understand that your current situation is hard for both of you. For her to feel that she has to be perfect or she may loose you must be a strain, and we all want to be accepted as we are, but do persevere and don't allow yourself to think about the OW.

I don't know where you are spiritually, but Raymond and I are Christians, and talking to God(our amazing Father) is a real help, and He cares about every aspect of our lives. If you want to, just talk to Him as if he was in the room with you, nothing 'religious', and pour out all this stuff and ask for His help. Be honest and open.
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Old 2nd October 2013, 09:18 AM   #98
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
What you had (or though you had) with the OW, wasn't real life. The attraction that you felt was intense because it was new and exciting and forbidden. That too would have died down, and once it did, the day to day living/working/sleeping etc would have been far more routine. You remember it with such powerful feelings, because it never got past that initial attraction phase and into real every day life, so you can make it what you want it to be in you mind.
Chosen, I totally feel the same.

Married men longing for something he's not getting from his marriage, constantly regretting he had married her by MISTAKE - it seems this is one of the most common themes over this site...

There are two types of married men: Men who try to find happiness within marriage and he loves his wife (emotional attachment) despite personal issues and problems life throws at them.

Another type of men who constantly unhappy with his wife and he longs for all consuming romantic love (perhaps) with someone else (someone new) he feels able to open up. He is detached from his wife emotionally but carries on having "obligation sex" to keep her happy.

Sunny, have you considered a trial separation? That would be one way of finding out if you really do not love your wife anymore? I wonder what age range you are? Does getting older worry you?

If you never loved your wife from the start but married her out of obligation or by mistake, then that's probably the likely reason of your current dissatisfaction. There was no love to begin with then, as years go on, it gets harder and harder.

Having said that even if you met someone else you "truly" adore, the initial intense feeling of love DOES NOT LAST FOREVER. Any relationship/marriage demands work..and then you would be back to the same/similar situation.
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Old 2nd October 2013, 01:15 PM   #99
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

You have to do what you think is the right thing, take every day one at a time.
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Old 2nd October 2013, 08:59 PM   #100
Raymond
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

I think maybe you are chasing the feeling of love which as Roses said is pretty fleeting Sunny. Do you watch a lot of romantic films by any chance?

I used to be in love as a fourteen year old. The girl was much younger so I couldn't really bring it to anything but I always thought about her. I met her many years later and got the impression she just slept around. My fantasies about her had to die a death.

The only other time was in a church I was in where if this girl walked past me my heart would pound. The feeling was not mutual as it turned out.

Later on there was a girl who fell in love with me and couldn't eat her food properly. Apparently this went on for two years and she had to have counseling from the pastor and his wife. In the end they said he has to know so I got it from the pastor that she was in love with me. Although there was a chemical attraction (one can get that with many people as a single) I was not in love with her in the sense of a pounding heart. Yes she was attractive but I didn't really have that oomph which one kind of expects. Whilst looking around still I did pray about it. Eventually I just had a peace about it after dating her for a while so we got married. What helped me is the scripture husbands love your wives as your own body. We have grown closer and closer over the years and I now believe that she is God's gift to me. I would never have picked her with a passion but I am so grateful that I am married to her. Our love for each other is real and enduring. Apparently the honeymoon period only lasts two years at the most anyway. I can honestly say that I am very happily married.

What bothers me a bit about your story Sunny is that your wife is still not secure in your love even though you say you have been loving her. You say she feels she must be perfect for fear of losing you. I find that very sad that she has never found the security and rest in your love but that she has to strive to keep it. Perfect love casts out all fear. Something she has never known unless she gets it from God. Real love is not just based on a feeling. You cannot say that you have shown her perfect love if she is still insecure in it. Real love would want to give her the assurance that she is loved. I think if you went for that it would come back to you in bucket loads.
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Old 2nd October 2013, 11:09 PM   #101
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

What does the therapist say to all of this?

I actually think that a separation may be disastrous at this time.

I suppose that acceptance of the situation is what is needed. We all have things in our lives that we are disappointed about and would rather we had done differently,(I certainly do), but to keep looking back to the past and what may have been is pointless and doesn't help at all. An appreciation of what we DO have, and a real contentment in our lives makes all the difference.

You have no idea whether things would have worked with the OW. Most relationships that begin with one or both leaving their spouse dont last. No one is completely open and honest at work, and no one shows all of their weakness and failings and bad habits except to their very close family.

I cant imagine what it must be like for your wife to never be sure if you are going to walk out on her again or not. It must be horrible. However she is willing to try and she is now showing that she can change.

I suppose because I know this life isn't all there is, I can see the future as positive and glorious, and not think this is it. The best is yet to come. The only real and true and ever lasting love is from God our Father, and ultimately its only that Love from Him that satisfies us completely. All human love is flawed, and we can all be pretty selfish at times cant we. People will always disappoint us to some extent, and no one person will ever be able to meet all of our needs, and it wouldnt be fair to expect them to.

Sorry I don't mean to preach. I just felt it was right to say a bit about all this. I dont usually 'spout off' so bear with me.

Last edited by chosen; 3rd October 2013 at 10:01 AM.
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Old 3rd October 2013, 11:18 AM   #102
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

Raymond You really are incredibly so amazing. Your grace shines through your words of compassion and so much love..... You have so much to offer and your post made me cry for sheer gentleness.

Sunny my thoughts are with you.

I'm sure many people are "trapped" in unhappy marriage.

Have you had any legal advice more recently? You shouldn't allow yourself to be exposed to her abuse / threat. That is a form of violence / aggression even though she probably does this out of defence or underlying frustration.

As far as I can see, what may complicate the issue is that you still have sex with your wife (expression of sexual unity/love) then she thinks you still "love" her. This is no criticism from me. I also think this is sending a very confused message that you are still committed to her when you don't love her at all.

But as a woman, I am often amazed how men can just do it even if you have little feelings for the person. But I digress....

Chosen. Wise words indeed.
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Old 3rd October 2013, 07:10 PM   #103
chosen
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

In your case sunny, I dont see the point of a trial separation. What are you trying out? You have already said that you feel you would be happier without her, so for you I think a separation would be the end. I cant only see the point of a trial separation if you are both wanting to have counselling and work on getting back together, but feel that a time apart may help in this process(as has happened with Barry on this forum)

Most people say they want a separation when in fact they want a divorce, but don't want to actually tell the other person that, so they try and cushion the news by diluting it.

I agree with you, in that your wife is so worried and afraid that you will leave, that she uses the children as a threat out of her fear. I can understand that totally. I would be devastated if my husband wanted to leave. You can do and say desperate things when you feel desperate and vulnerable yourself. Like a cornered animal.

In the Bible the reasons given for ending a marriage are either 'pornea' (a greek word that means sexual immorality) or abandonment. I would also say that serious abuse of any
sort is reason to separate, if one spouse or the children are at risk of serious harm.
Sexual immorality doesn't just mean adultery, but can also mean other types of sexual sin such as serious porn use(in my opinion) or doing other sexual things with another person. I tend to stick to what God says because I trust Him.
No where is the fact that you feel you don't love that person, or you are not very happy with them, given as a valid reason to end a marriage, but of course many do end it for those reasons.

I agree about the sex thing. I have no idea how women can have sex with a man they barely know. I would have to love the man for it to mean anything. Sadly that's the standard of the world today, that sex on the first or second date is normal.
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Old 3rd October 2013, 09:02 PM   #104
Raymond
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

She feels the need to constantly be better to hold on to me, which is a terrible burden to live under. For her or you Sunny? I don't think she has ever known security. Certainly not in her marriage. You sound as if you have been pulling away all the way through it. It sounds like your attempts to mend it didn't work so I kind of suspect that real commitment from you was not there. She wouldn't need to fight if there was. I think it would be terribly sad if you just left her after all these years. Until you decide to commit to her for better or worse I don't see a solution. If you are always looking over your shoulder it won't work. Whatever happened regarding the initial marrying is all water under the bridge. I think you need to forget the past and press on into to the future with her. Wives tend to blossom when they are really loved. I think this romance thing is a red herring that you give too much credence to. How much happiness have you lost through that? Certainly the real stability of your marriage.

Anyway that's how I feel. I can never counsel you to desert her in spite of what you say. It is more than just staying with her. I think you need to actively create an emotional security through your love for her. I think that when she knows she is loved for herself without having to earn it you will see massive changes. I believe you can do that if you set your heart on it. You don't need to look inside yourself for the right feeling. If you actively aim to truly love her the feelings will automatically follow. Love is an act not a feeling ultimately.
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Old 4th October 2013, 10:26 AM   #105
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Re: I don't love my wife and never have...

Hi

If I am allowed to be bluntly honest, I am increasingly so amazed how hard it is for wives to please their men/husband. Their wives are never deserving enough, never attractive enough, never the object of their desire etc.

It seems husbands have a very fixed idea as to how their wives should look like, behave etc to deserve their love. Knowing how many husbands share this strong sentiment together, it's probably a "men thing". No wonder "prostitution" is all time popular from time immemorial for dissatisfied husbands who feel stuck and so disappointed by their wives in their marriage....(this comment isn't directed at anyone in particular..! x) Even with these ladies, once they go home, I bet they look like "ordinary" women.

In movies, attractive movie stars wake up from sleep fully made up and it isn't quite like that in a real life! (?) I'm sure movie stars will look totally different off screen to be honest.

I don't believe a trial separation will automatically mean any divorce. Since you commented how badly your wife is speaking of you in front of your children, the atmosphere at home is already quite toxic to you?

As I said before and you said very thoughtfully that your therapist commented also, that you will not be able to move on (either progress on marriage or otherwise) by continuing to keep having sex with your wife whom you are SO DEEPLY UNHAPPY WITH. I think this will lead to a much bigger problem/hurt in a long run to my mind...

Having this sort of sex is probably extremely hurtful to most women who might think their husbands still love them without realizing that his mind is very much detached from her. You say you are able to tolerate your marriage better this way but it strikes me this is utterly unacceptable. (not said in a critical way x)
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